which classic wipeout tracks would you like to see revamped in a future installment?

[Valparaiso]

and what would you change about them? i really loved the classic leagues in pure, and i'm sure liverpool studios will continue to pay tribute to the old favourites, but i think pure's choice of classic tracks neglected a few that really deserve better treatment than they were originally given. particularly those from 2097; i think the game suffered hugely from a lack of intensity and replayability. somehow i never cared whether i won or lost in 2097. but each track was just a breeze to fly on. i would like to see the following circuits brought back and made more challenging, to suit the diversified and more engrossing gameplay innovations seen in Pure:

Sagar Matha- maybe set at night, with icier conditions and possibly some terraform sections. Wider sections of the track for improved battling and more steep climbs and fast slopes.

Valparaiso- i love the lurid, saturated green look of the jungle and the general track design. but some multiple route sections and faster straights would be cool. i think valparaiso could really become a seminal battling track with pure's well-tuned weapons system.

Phenitia Park- good as it is, but i think it would benefit from some wacky features like loop the loops, big jumps and some wiggly karbonis-esque halfpipe bends.

Vostok Island/Spilskinanke- two of the coolest wipeout tracks ever imo, but they suffered from a lack of visibility and 2097's unforgiving thunkiness. brighten them up, lose the merciless checkpoint countdown, and signpost some of those blind corners.

[Lion]

not too keen on loops, but I'd be keen to see Phenitia Park return

[Rapier Racer]

I want Gare d’Europa! In addition I'd like it fully rendered please none of this virtual reality nonsense like we have in Pure, ugh. It does not need changing the original was perfect, perfect I say! Loops? I don’t care for and they don’t work so well anyway, what happens when you’re at the top of it upside down and someone hits you with rockets? The craft would simply have to drop down onto its roof and I’ve already grown to hate my craft ending up on its roof from the few times it’s happened on Pure.

I’d like to see Terminal make a return too.

[Zerow]

All of them, preferably!

However, if I were limited to just five:

1) Altima VII

2) Valparaiso

3) Gare D'Europa

4) Manor Top

5) Mandrashee 3 (Forward)

I wouldn't make any modifications to any of them, as they're each fine as they are (if not masterpieces, in the case of the last three).

[Valparaiso]

I’d like to see Terminal make a return too.

terminal was the coolest wo3 track, second only to p-mar project which is the most beautiful track in the series. sheer utopia.

[Lance]

I’d like to see Terminal make a return too.

I love that course! When I first joined the WZ, Jay and I raced a lot there against each other [in unrealtime]. It's a high-speed waltz.

[Task]

That was indeed quite awesome.

I still love Terminal because of all the time we spent racing it.
Did I like it that much before? Hmm, hard to say, it was so long ago...
Perhaps, but probably not.
You really have to fly a track a lot to gain such a high level of appreciation for it. Something that stands up well to that many repeat playings just shows its quality.

Getting back to topic though, recreations of tracks that were great in a specific version of WO don't always come through so well in later versions. Like the 8+ extra tracks in SE, I just don't like them as much in SE as I do in their "home version". I've heard similar things about the recreation of Manor Top. Those tracks are made for the physics of the WO they were built for, and it doesn't seem to follow that they'll be good tracks in a different physics model.

The one exception might be WOXL and WO64, but that's likely because WO64 is pretty much a port of WOXL with the same physics.

Anyway, in the end while it's all well and good to have old tracks come back for a repeat performance in a later version, it's much more important to have new tracks that were explicity designed for that WO. I'd rather have new tracks than old, and I can't think of a single case where I'd go the other way.

[Dominator]

I agree with Zerow "All of them" and i would like to see them pretty much in there original form, with next gen graphics "wow"
I think the original tracks are about the best there are imo anyway!!

[Sausehuhn]

If there're classic tracks again, please don't change their course. Making them wider or adding new routes just make them to another track - which can be better, but in most cases it isn't.

Classic tracks should really be as they are originally. No recreation, cause this will change the track. Even when it's just a slightly change, it can change the whole track experience. And if there's no way to get back the old track data, then I would rather don't have these tracks than having them recreated.

I'm pretty sure that just Fusion's and Pure's original track data is still available. So there is a decision to make: just implement tracks from these two games, or use them and also the recreated, or leave them all out.

Generally all tracks should get a graphic update, nothing more. This means bitmaps with higher resolution, reworked models (e.g.: making a hemisphere more rounded) and maybe some details added (e.g.: if the original model has a bitmap with a cavity on it, the reworked model could now actually have the cavity instead of just having a bitmap showing it).
But all in all the original track and its surrounding should stay so it does not lose it's original character and feeling.
This should be the easiest for Fusion and Pure tracks as these are the newest and complexest so far. The PS1 models aren't that complex, so these maybe need new models added instead of just old models reworked.
I'm talking about models in the surrounding here, not models on the track (cause these would change the track itself again).

As Task already said, it's also a matter of the ship's physics. I'm not sure if all Pure tracks work if they cut out the sideshifiting. Or if all tracks are as thrilling as they're now without barrelrolling.

So, enough words said, here is my 1st small list with just a very small selection:


Stanza Inter.
This track is just blazing. It's not just the track itself, it's also the mood you have on this one. These huuuge buildings around you - just awesome.
I really could imagine a reworked version here, with even higher buildings and vehicles moving over the city which give the track more "life".
In general, I would like to see a track in big city in the next WipEout. Not sure if this surrounding should be used for a classic track though. But if, then definitely Stanza.

Florion Height 3
An outpost in the desert. Yes. God, I just love this one. I really do. The feeling, the track, the freeform section, all just fits. You really get this feeling you're here alone in the desert with a bunch of people living there in this small "citycenter" with it's powerhouse.
Sadly they would have to leave out the looping and I'm not sure yet if they should stay with the course and implement a S-turn where the looping was or if they should slightly change the course to a straight.

Mandrashee 3 or 2 reverse
Or both
I really like these tracks. Not sure about Mandrashee 3, because of it's screw that probably won't work with the new physics. I'm also not sure if they should make it the same way as they did it with Pure's version: make a bumping section out of it.
This problem won't be that huge with the 2nd track, cause the "connection" to the screw is on it's end, so there could be made a steep turn out of it without noticing the change too much.

Citta Nuova
Already a classic (at least for me). Nothing more to say besides I'm not sure if it works without sideshifiting.


So that was my 1st small selection

[bakkufu]

Qoron IV for sure, that was an awesome track!!!!

I would like to see more stands and viewing platforms though, sometimes it feels like the only spectators for the future sport are at the start line lol

[lunar]

some of the changes to the classic tracks have definitely been for the better though, imo. Pure`s Odessa Keys is a big improvement on the old ones, I think. It`s certainly the only version of OK which is fun to play, for me. The back straight of Pure Mandrashee, with its weird camber, gives a fantastic on the edge feeling at Phantom. As Task said, just porting a track without changes might not suit the handling in another game, so if changes are going to improve the experience I say go for it.

Certainly the best track designs in Pure, I think, are the later ones specifically designed for the game, in Gamma, Delta and Omega, when I guess the team had just got better at it. Ubermall, Staten Park, Koltiwa and Burgertown are just perfection for Pure`s physics, which I think goes to show that you have to make all tracks suitable for the specific game, and that is more important than being true to the old track. Manor Top in Pure is very very much like the original in scale, but isn`t a whole lot of fun. Odessa Keys is completely different in many ways, but is a blast.

But I totally agree about Stanza Inter, Max. I was going to post in favour of that earlier, but couldn`t be bothered. I think that track, as is, would really suit the sideshift and handling in Pure, and in a future game if it`s going to be based on Pure.

[JABBERJAW]

"to suit the diversified and more engrossing gameplay innovations seen in Pure:"

I don't think many people would agree that pure has better gameplay mechanics than 2097/xl, although the competition is better(at cheating)

[guillaume]

I onlly know Pure. But what do you mean by cheating?

[Rapier Racer]

If it’s a reference to 2097, you could cut out huge sections of track in the faster classes and go right through what should have been solid buildings; however it wasn't always easy to do so an element of skill was involved. For the ultimate track cutting experience you need Wipeout 3 SE an Icaras and Porto Kora if I recall correctly?

[ace-of-spades]

The first track from the original wipeout, which i cant remember the name of... I like the big climb about half way through.

I think it would also be nice if they started putting what country the tracks are in again, i just like it as a little touch that makes it more "realistic".

[Lion]

guillaume: I think jabberjaw was referring to the AI not having to pass over weapon pads to get their weapons some of the time. eg: iirc they all start with a turbo

[Asayyeah]

For the ultimate track cutting experience you need Wipeout 3 SE an Icaras and Porto Kora if I recall correctly?

Honestly all the tracks have shortcuts in SE ; the most terrific place to do insane shortcuts was terramax me-thinks with 3 massives one

[blackwiggle]

Well guys you have to look at things going to a HD format...that equals more space on a disc..be it HDDVD or Blueray.

Not hard to see where the Wipeout series might progress...or might be replenished..as in ....the old reprogrammed into the new at a higher level.

Bring it on.

[Dominator]

The first track from the original wipeout, which i cant remember the name of... I like the big climb about half way through.

Altima V11

[ace-of-spades]

Yeah, thats the one. I just went and played Wipeout to see if that was the one i meant, i was there for like an hour, haha!