Even worse when you are leading and get a quake, or right at the back and get mines... thats always been annoying lolQuote:
Originally Posted by drenath
Printable View
Even worse when you are leading and get a quake, or right at the back and get mines... thats always been annoying lolQuote:
Originally Posted by drenath
And I think you missed Paradoxx's point. Leaving in the barrel rolls but replacing their gameplay function with superficial "freestyle points" would make them more of a cheap extreme sports gimmick than you claim they already are.Quote:
Originally Posted by klax75
As I tried to say earlier, barrel rolling as a gameplay function is hardly a gimmick -- it's a technique that requires driving skill and energy management (someone enforced the point earlier that you also have to deal with disorientation when coming out of a barrel). It seems to me you have a problem with the actual animation; the thought of one of these ships doing a side roll in midair is too flashy for you. Or maybe some of you just don't like the logic... why would spinning around and landing upright magically grant you a speed boost?
Well, how does the anti-gravity technology in this future world work, precisely? Would you feel better if someone at Studio Liverpool came up with a technical canon reason why barrel rolling exists as a viable anti-gravity racing technique?
I can understand not wanting to do them to complete speed laps and time trials. Hey, I beat Zico, and it was no picnic. In my experience, having to pull off a set number of barrel rolls in a single lap to get a good record is difficult, frustrating, and ultimately not much fun. But aside from Zico and a few awfully stressing time trial gold medals in campaign mode, you do not need to use barrel rolls to complete the game. You do need to use them to get great online records. And they'll probably help your chances of winning when you're racing online. If that bothers you, I don't know what to tell you. Great racers will get good records. Great racers who can expertly utilize barrel rolls will get better records. That's just how it is.
Shame, i don't have time or enough vocabularies to explain my point of view about BR again, but captain Howdy you resumed my mind.
I am with you !
Well said captain! :+ I've been introducing lately friends and family into wipeout and I realiced that br's are not a cheap trick for newcomers to get good times, they need practice to be done properly. I would say that some people that answered "no" use them much more often and better than I do. :P
I understand what you are saying, and what Paradoxx is too. To me it just makes WipeOut feel extremely cheap. It's no different then in the game Pure I do a trick to get energy to be able to use Boost.Quote:
Originally Posted by captain howdy
For me it just feels like SL is doing what all races games are doing, to do a trick move, or a combo move to give a boost. I have said before, fine if there are BR SL love them. Then why can't we map the controls to what is comfortable to the players. Like the L2, R2, L2 idea. This would be optional to your playing style.
That L2. R2, L2 move is not logical,....
when that was the barrel roll move, the zone trophy with only airbrakes would be impossible,...
also steering in some corners would come down to a barrel chaos....
Why would it? A BR can only be triggered while in the air anyway...
I understand that they take skill to perform and land, especially at speed. I simply don't like them. I do not enjoy the modification to gameplay that BRs introduced, and I don't particularly think they are a good gameplay mechanic.
That being said - I will still do them to get good times, however. They're in Wipeout HD, and we have to play the game we've got.
I just personally wish that they weren't in the game.
yes rejj, the more I play SL, the more I'm thinking like you. A good anulpha reverse lap = 2 brs. A perfect one : 3 brs. My thumb hurts a lot. I think this br need is too much, maybe worse than pulse. 5 brs a lap for some tracks? that's insane hardcore gamer stuff, more than ever. But I'll give it a try.
I can see 2 BRs on Anulpha reverse (one boosting out of the tunnel, one after the hill before the last long right), but THREE?! Where?
The bump before the last 3 boosts.
Can one at the end of the 1st long right hander too.
yeah there's 3 BRs and it's a different sheme from what you are using Martin atm ( i did 20.99 with the technique you explained and there's like 2 tenths to cut in order to get the perfect laptime with those 2 BRs.)
But we can race faster with 3 BRs : get the normal route and when you approach the 1st difficultie ( hard right curve ) you boost, BR and land before the begining of that narrow section.then at the top of the narrow section ( where's there's 2 BPads in semi diagonale) you hit one of them ( mostly the right one) up your nose and BR get the 3 BP in diagonal and then the last BR and be as close as possible of the inside right on the last curve.
The boost and BR is really tricky to use, i constantly hit walls and walls but got a promising 21.05 with that technique.
Ill copy and paste that into the tips for HD ;)
100% with this comment.Quote:
Originally Posted by rejj
same here, rejj`s post sums up my feelings better than my 357 previous posts about BRs ;)
Same here. And I must admit that there is some satisfaction in speeding down the last part of a race, head to head with a competitor, and then boosting ahead and winning because I managed to pull off a BR and he didn't. At the same moment, the frustration on the other side is unnessecary...
I quite like BRs, but think they may be over-used (on a times per race basis). Perhaps better balancing by making them cost more shields? The activation method is too unreliable though, I'd much rather have it bound to buttons than the analog stick (switching to dpad doesn't count). I'd say overload the airbrakes, but I hate that SS overloads them already; I've lost count of the number of times I've SS'ed by mistake while making minor turn corrections. Having L1 and R1 purely as 'stunt' keys - tap L1 to SS left, R1 to SS right would be good, but people probably quite like them as rear view and comms... Looking for controls not used yet we find... the right analog stick! Tap it Left or Right while on the track for SS and push it L or R in the air to BR. Might take a bit of getting used to, taking your thumb off the throttle, but I think it'd work pretty good - a lot like dodging in God of War.
Anyway, an option for hosts to disable BRs in their multiplayer games would be good, as would an option in the control setup to disable SS entirely (I'd much rather not be able to SS at all than keep screwing up corners due to accidental activation).
EDIT: alternative to Right Analog: use the 6axis - a violent jerk of controller left or right - to activate SS and BR.
Please don't make them Sixaxis. Being disabled in real life, in games I have to turn off sixaxis since I physically cannot do it. I have very small hands (and body to match lol) It's very frustrating now days that so many games have body movement in them. One of the reasons I play video games is to be able to do things I can't do in real life. Now over time I won't be able to do those either. I know I am minority on this too. Like the Wii I can't do the movements so I really can't play it. I do agree it is fun watching other people do it though. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Sideshow
I'd really like to be able to set barrel rolls to something else, my hands are stretched enough when using the stick.
I know this is simple and people may hate it, what about Hitting R1 then left or right depending on what kind of barrel roll, to do a Barrel roll. If you do it quick then you release R1 you could still steer your ship. And this would give the possibility to do multiple barrel rolls for more speed in one jump.
I would prefer they were gone all together. It just seems like down the road they could add flips and flat spins too. :(
I don't get the more damage for barrel roll thing. Here is my thinking on this. Let's make more energy come off for a barrel rolls so it limits them. This will cause them to become "not fun" to use at all. I think that is why there were put into the game to begin with, and the constant worry of using up all of your energy would make it a complete chore to use them. I think the energy taken off is pretty good on HD.
That being said, unless the game is sped up, I would like to leave them in just for that reason.
That being said, if the game can be sped up, remove them, they are a nuisance since they still do not work all of the time, or have a delayed reaction, well after the button presses, and the hand has been removed from the pad, it then works except you do not make the roll because it activated way too late wasting a bunch of your energy, and not even getting a speed boost. Yes, I can force it to work most of the time even under this circumstance, but it is a pain.
I still find barrel rolls not to be even near the problem of sideshift though, those freaking things take the feel of wipeout completely away. at least barrel rolls don't mess with the physics of the ship
I think they work a little better than they did in pure and pulse, but its a pain that the controls for activation has not been revised since its debut (like move them to another button as mentioned previously) . Sometimes I get the impression that it expects a full press on the D-pad rather than a nudge. Problem is, the faster I go, the less I tend to press the button fully. If it is going to return in future wipeout games, it needs to be mapped to another button rather than interrupt the craft control.
I agree, I would be happier with a barrel roll button, I don't like the interference with the steering as well. Either that or a turbo button like wo3