v1.30 update complaints

After an hour long session this morning (my second after the update), I'd have to agree with most of your observations that there are more mines and bombs now, than there were previously. In last night's session there was one stand out race on Ubermall where there was an extremely high count of eliminations - this was noted by other racers in that game. There was another race on Chengou Project (4 laps) where I was eliminated 3 times, the first of which was just at the beginning of the 2nd lap - I'm not the greatest pilot by any stretch but I can never remember that happening to me before.

Someone else has noted (either in this thread or another) that it is harder to break free from the pack. I'd have to agree with that too - not that it doesn't happen, but this morning I was in several races that were very congested for a long time.

The update has introduced some good features: friend invites, rating system, and ability to see all games just to name a few, but if what we have observed turns out to be an attempt to level the playing field by the developers, lets hope they reverse those particular changes.

I think they really should look at the feedback people are giving here and take note. So far weapons off races have been far more enjoyable for me. Weapons on races are just a joke now. Stinky-winky's right. You can't challenge yourself when it comes to the mines because they cover the whole track. Unless perhaps you can find a way to sideshift off the track and back onto it again while going in a straight line. That could work.

I also tried harimau. That was a whole new level of strange. It always had a different feel to it but has probably changed the most now out of the ships I tried. Assegai felt the same to me though and I'm fairly well re-accustomed to Icaras now. EG-X was a pile of poop though :( But that could have had more to do with bad luck, perhaps.

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Originally Posted by leungbok

Wipeout was renowned for its speed ! But now speed will be hard to reach, maybe it was time to convert the game from a racing to a shooter :?

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that already happened a few games back!

all this talk of the dodgy patch is a shame. i've already told my housemate, whose ps3 i play HD on from time to time to not download this update...sounds bad. hope they can sort it out.

Got the update and it froze every time I had to load Wipeout. Had to delete all my saved data.

Not really a big deal for me.

Went online and F*** me what a pile of sh**e. WTF are they thinking about????????

There is F all racing skill required now. The ships handle completely differently and as a lifelong fan - I'm shocked. Really really shocked and let down and bloody bloody angry.

I'll not be playing until they sort it, I can't, it's way too annoying.
What a fecking shame.

I'm glad to see some other people getting emotional about it. There are so many issues with it. It's quite inconceivable what they've done to my favourite game ever, and my favourite thing in the world right now. If it weren't for the chatbox feature I wouldn't have stayed online tonight. People on this site and the social element they bring are the main (only?) reason to play online now.

Change isn't good or bad, it's just different. But an update or patch like this shouldn't just be different, it should be an improvement, an evolution of the game. But it just plain isn't. It's as if they've screwed over the people who've maintained interest in it the longest in order to bring new people to the game. For that reason I still think it's about cold hard cash. Whatever happens Sony and SL are businesses. They have bills to pay. The game needs to attract attention to sell more copies and to make money. Perhaps it's more of a sign of the times and the whole recession thing than it is of trying to improve the game.

I thought I was done with whining and gave it another chance this evening. Whilst I'm calmer about it all now I'm still very upset about it. I can look at it more calmly and objectively but I just don't see myself getting over it without some big changes. I don't think they can completely undo the update. Imagine how embarassing that would be. Possibly the best thing they could do would be to let people choose exactly what weapons they want. That way we could just disable mines and I feel that would be a massive step in the right direction. Then fix whatever the lag issues are that are making barrel rolls fail online. I don't mean hard to pull off. I mean fail. This is what's happening. Then give me the option to disable the spectator function so that I don't have all that glitching/freezing in my games. With all that, things might get back to being fun and I could start forgiving those who stole my first true love away from me.:lol

Emotional? Wait, what?

Personally, the game feels almost indentical to how it played before and I therfore have no complaints with the patch (the login issue has been fixed here) other than the odd random lag freezes in-game.

Only thing I noticed was mines where more 'there' and harder to miss.

Seriously, don't know what some of you are on about. I've found weapon races more exciting and hardcore than ever.

L.A.W

When I got the update I'd heard nothing on it from anyone else. I came to my own conclusions and I came to them fairly quickly. A racing game, even with weapons, should be primarily about the racing, about the speed. There's no momentum at all in weapons games now because the track is littered with mines.

Also, why do people keep quoting this "L.A.W." thing? Let's draw a parellel here. I enjoy playing guitar. It takes practise and it takes skill for me to be able to play songs on my guitars. Now imagine someday someone comes along, knocks on my door, grabs my guitar, smashes it on the ground, hands me a ukelele and says "Here's a new challenge for ya, L.A.W!". To me, that's pretty much equivalent to what the update has done to the game. If I'd wanted to play the ukelele I would have bought one. As Leungbok says:

"Wipeout was renowned for its speed ! But now speed will be hard to reach, maybe it was time to convert the game from a racing to a shooter"

Saturn is right - and I'm willing to bet you that 90% of the top 20 players will agree with Saturn.

The handling IS different, the freezing is rampant, people who couldn't even get close to me, suddenly they're all over me. (which, prior to this patch - was not the case) Barrel roll success rate has dropped by at last a factor of 2 since this patch.

I'm a decent player - but far from the top - yet somehow, I managed to DNF AN ENTIRE ROOM OF PLAYERS. No freeze, no glitch - I lapped the ENTIRE ROOM in a 4 lap race and not one of them finished, 7 people... I still can't understand how that transpired.

Oh yeah, then the 3 races just today, where I literally got plasma, shield, plasma, shield, plasma, shield, plasma, shield (nothing but)....... My friend (who doesn't play this) heard it, and asked if I was using a cheat code.

Triakis now blowing AG Systems, and Goteki 45 off the line every time - and no, it's not lag people.

So yeah, different? You bet. :(

Was the freezing mentioned? Lots of page-tearing now, too.

I was open at first - but not even a day into this I'm going to depart.

There are good aspects - I love that you can see barrell rolls, disable AP, have extended lap races.... but we've traded too much (in terms of stable - consistent gameplay) for them, IMO.

Well I doubt that they'd all agree with my rampant complaining. So I apologise to everyone for that. But yes, most people I spoke to soon after the update mentioned all the things I've mentioned, and very often without any hints from me. So I think a lot of players or of the opinion that the game has (for them) been negatively impacted. I for one would like some way to minimise this so that I can enjoy the game again.

Alright, so if the online racing has just become a matter of luck than skill, tell me, how come I'm still in the same place of having my ass handed to me to players like Wotan, Saturn, Greenix etc., that I was before?

I can hardly read these threads about "how v1.30 is shiat" without wanting to kill a small child out of anger - anger that I only reach in Wipeout-related discussion when people whine about every new game not being an exact copy of Wipeout XL with high-res graphics and online play when it's in development.

I can't stand this attitude coming from supposed elite players who keep complaining that someone at my level can actually win a race against them, when in reality I still can't find myself "lucking my way into winning all the time". If I was actually winning races consistently I'd actually feel some sympathy. But I don't. Because I'm not. AND I'VE BEEN PLAYING THIS SERIES FOR THIRTEEN SODDING YEARS.

It almost reminds me of what's going on in F1 right now, with McLaren and Ferrari and BMW being outclassed by BrawnGP and Toyota in the first two races - so instead of developing their car to keep up, they may actually lead a successful bitch-and-moan at the FIA to nullify their achievements.

So cry, cry all you want about how spectator mode and handling tweaks and especially a good amount of online activity is ruining your experience. I could honestly not give a god damn. Because nothing has changed so far on my end. Am I being selfish, crass, maybe I don't get the point of what everyone's so busy complaining about? Yes, and I could care less.

And no, this update isn't perfect, there are some other things I'd like to have seen with the online experience, but it's not killing the game from where I can see.

(Now that I'm done, go ahead and flame away!)

without a doubt something has changed in the handling. Ag is twitchy as hell now and it does feel and act lighter, if i didn't know better i would of thought it was a feisar. BR's are not more difficult to pull off at all. They are not happening full stop. please no one tell me it is just me. On sebenco i only managed 1 in the whole race.

Lets not go over the top here though. we have been like rampant dogs for a long time for more features, now we have them we are tearing it to bits. They must be banging their heads on the table at SL thinking 'are they never satisfied'. give it a chance. There's lots of good stuff there, it just needs sorting out

RJ - I can see where you're coming from. Yeldar's always saying how he sucked so badly and yet usually still beats me by about 5 seconds. I didn't mean to make anyone feel bad or anything. I apologise. But Yeldar makes the point that he can't get close to his own times now. I don't think this is a lack of skill on his part.

The thing is, winning or losing aside, the game seems to have lost momentum and speed because of the crazy mines, uber-rockets and glitching. I think many would agree. But these aren't the only issues. Messed up record tables, corrupted save data, poor presentation. There's that phrase: "If a job is worth doing, it's worth doing well." Had this been implemented better then I'm sure extra features would have been welcomed by all. But it wasn't, or at least doesn't seem to have been for me. And to those making the point that it happens with other games too, well two wrongs don't make a right.

If some aren't experiencing the same negative gameplay then that's good. But if you read all the posts then I think an aweful lot of players of varied abilities are. Whether you like the patch or not, so much negative feedback, whoever it comes from, however well or bady it is expressed, cannot be a a good thing.

KGB - I was still content with the game. The only things I wanted were minor tweaks. I know you're not referring directly to me or anything. Just sayin'.

RJ - I fully agree with you. I dont know if people classify me as "Elite" but I can go toe to toe with some of this forums higher ranked Members, and I still can. (After this patch that is) Yeah lag sucks when I need to stay in front of yeldar get a mini Lag spike and slam into a wall. but the internet isnt perfect. these things happen. I just shrug it off (and maybe the 10 mines I slam into) and just keep chugging away.

I still manage to get within 2 seconds of the leaders most of the time if Ive had an Absolutley Horrid race. I just adapt and go "this is the game now, No point complaining"

Saturn - Yes mines are annoying but its your fault if your going full speed without looking ahead (I do this all the time, Ive changed to slow down at choke points to watch for mine) and you MIGHT have to slow down to get around them (that is unless you want to slam into them) but this is wipeout now.

You can... (Complain is such an ugly word) Express your displeasure with the patch but are you really going to roll over and admit defeat and give up your favorite game over a few sets of mines?

I feel your pain, But dont let your Love for wipeout fade because of one bad patch Aye?

For the rest of you...

I do believe Lehab has mention that SCEE (or maybe SL I cant remember) Has addressed the lag problem, this should be getting dealt with. as for the mines and BR's. You might just have to fix your timing.

The mine tweaks I'm sort of indifferent to since I have such awful luck racing online anyway.

If you ask me the weapon pads do not need to be deactivated for so f*cking long after someone flies over them, I cannot, CANNOT F*CKING STAND having to lift off until they re-activate and I lose an assload of track position. That's one of the big changes I'm still waiting for.

As for the handling tweaks, well, I still find it weird that Thrust and Handling are usually all that matter in racing usually, which is why AG Systems, FEISAR, Harimau and Goteki dominated - then there's Icaras and Auricom which are pretty mediocre at both, but they're still on that same level. So shouldn't Triakis and Piranha be just as good as Auricom and Icaras despite having one less point of thrust than they do? Shouldn't EG-X be absolutely amazing with handling on par with Icaras, thrust on par with AG Systems and speed on par with Assegai, instead of being a lardy, useless utter piece of sh*t? I applaud them for at least trying to level it out, although I'll also agree they didn't need to change the lighter handling ships as much.

overall for me, the framerate I found to be as good or better, but lost one race tonight due to the ****ing game stop for two second on lap 5. The barrel roll works in some races, and when I was playing darkdrium one on one, it was decent for me until lap 4/5 when it wouldn 't work even when spazzing out, barrel rolling 10X the amount and it still did not work. TT seemed the same to me, and I will need to play a few more nights to see if the speed is different since I have some serious rust in the consisitency department.

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Originally Posted by Vartazian

Saturn - Yes mines are annoying but its your fault if your going full speed without looking ahead

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I've raced you plenty Vartazian. You're as fast as anyone and previously I always knew I would have a good game against you. But I find it a little disrespectful of you to say that. Not because I think I'm the dog's danglies or anything. But because I've spent a lot of time playing this game. I know what the tracks look like after 300 hours. I'm not looking behind me. To imply that I'm annoyed because I'm not paying attention or something, well, I just don't know what to say to that.

And to have the attitude that I should just accept things because someone else tells me they're going to be different now is also something I fundamentally disagree with. This is a thread for people to vent about the update if they have complaints. That's what I'm doing.

Also, you're still focussing on the mines. I admit I have done a lot too because I have big issues with it. But even if we put that aside then I can't ignore all the other problems that are really just unacceptable whether anyone has experienced them before or not. If all these issues had existed in a game that I had newly purchased then I would send that game straight back and I would be damn sure that the vendor knew about them.

i like what they have tried to do with the game, but unfortunately it has introduced a lot of annoyances and bugs. if properly fixed this could be a nice start to adding content to the game. UGH ! i also cant stand how my feisar handles

Putting aside all that I like with the new patch, here are several of my gripes:

Altitude sensitive BR's: Okay, I'm no BR fanatic, but not being able to perform those that I CAN pull off consistently off-line is just silly. Ubermall comes to mind firstly in that regard. The fact that it seems to be area specific also doesn't help at all.:naughty Lag or whatever is the cause should not matter.

Mines: I can see the need for making mines more visible, and larger to possibly fix the bomb problem we were experiencing. But, the time for them to explode too? My apologies but this should not be any different than off-line. 'nuff said.

Craft reaction: Overall I'd have to say this is my least favorite new "feature". I understand entirely making things more even, and therefore fun, but I think the craft reaction to weapons, walls, and other craft to be destroying the flow of many races I've been having. Now I DON't want to put it back the way it was, but a bit less would be A-OK.;)

Rank system: Too indescript imo. I have no idea if any of the races I'm taking part in mean anything. I race against people who are rank 8 I barely get any advancement. i play against someone maybe a rank or two below me my progress skyrockets. i just don't understand, so could someone from SL please explain what helps get your rank up officially so we're not just guessing?

That's all for now. Don't want to bore anyone. Just food for thought I guess.:)

Woah!
Angry crowd in here :o

I am sure SL realizes there are lag issues at the moment (which btw. of course also affects your ability to BR).
Haven't done much offline racing, but from the few laps I did do, it seemed like handling was normal there. So I am assuming most issues you are experiencing is due to lag and strained servers. I am guessing they will need some load data from the coming days to address this, since patch releases always generates abnormal traffic (they cannot size their services according to that).
Anyway, I agree with the online issues described by others in here, and I think, it is great people are providing their observations, but why are you assuming they are not working to fix it?

My apologies,.... but was that to me?

If so, be assured I know SL are probably downing coffee by the barrelful to fix these issues. I have had, and remain having, full faith in our intrepid creators of the greatest game in the universe.:g

It wasn't directed at anyone particular. Just the feel I got from reading many of the posts the last 2-3 pages in the thread :banzai

... and just to emphasize, Avenger, your post is a nice and constructive way of relaying concerns:+

Ah right. it was getting a bit hostile in here for a while. Hmm, I wonder if a new thread detailing what we would want changed might be a good idea?

The same as the changelog, yes why not.

As a side note, the freeze on startup issue because of 1.30 has been fixed. See, they're already doing stuff on it. :)

@ Saturn - I am truly sorry, it was not my intent to offend you. You clearly have played this game much longer then I have (hence why you are faster then me ;) ) But I just found it a little "weak" (for lack of a better term) That someone would complain about something as small and insignificant as mines.

Maybe Im overlooking things... that is not my intent... so I'm truly sorry. I just found myself adapting preety much right when the patch was released.. I think Im 11th or something right now overall. I just have to push that little much more to get up.

Nothing wrong with being displeased.. we just have different views is all =)

I just wanted to add my name to the list of people who have been experiencing any of the following;

* 1 second lags every now and then on most tracks, seems very random to me
* Game locking up during loading screens or during speccing (only solution is to restart the PS3)
* Broken weapon pads (you get no item when flying over them), happened on several tracks

Other than that I love the patch. The fun value of the game just got upped a couple of notches, and the changelog tells me that Studio Liverpool really listens to the player requests. But I definitely hope they can fix some of the bugs mentioned since they are can be game breaking. Keep up the good work

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Originally Posted by SaturnReturn

KGB - I was still content with the game. The only things I wanted were minor tweaks. I know you're not referring directly to me or anything. Just sayin'.

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Of course mate it wasn't directed at you, but at the moment there are about 4 or 5 different threads saying the same thing, so it was more a general feeling of mine about a lot of posts. I don't think there's any need for so many threads on one thing to be honest.

Infact i agree with you saturn, espescially the mines, they were perfectly fine as they were, they are a big problem now. I know they are staying on track for at least the time it takes to do a lap and for me to hit my own mines again. I havent checked lately (but i will) how many hours i have played but it could be close to 300 hrs! Like you, i think the game has become something different to what i was playing.

But I like the little things they have implemented in the update and can only see it as a good thing for the future. It will get better.

I have been playing Wipeout for 13 years as well and i feel that anyone who loves the game as much as Saturn does should be allowed to express his thoughts on the subject, and NOT be told he is crying about it. If anyone says to me LAW **** right off. IMHO.

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Originally Posted by Vartazian

That someone would complain about something as small and insignificant as mines.

Nothing wrong with being displeased.. we just have different views is all =)

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I think if you take those two sentences together, then it probably explains things. At my end they're not insignificant - in many races now they just are the game. Different people have a different experience of the online game. I think some of these things aren't subjective. From what people have said the mines things isn't happening offline. I'd agree with this, as my offline races were just much more fun. So I guess Soccermums is right, it's probably a lag related issue, which also means it could affect one person more than another. Now that I think about it - are most of the people having problems with mines in Europe?

Also Vartazian, I'm not sure I am faster than you. If I am then I doubt it's a massive amount as I've had plenty of good games with you. I've been seeing a lot of guys recently who pop up out of no-where and are really fast. You were one of them and when someone mentioned a Canadian Team for the World Cup you were my first thought for their 2nd player. I've probably just played longer and had more chance to get lucky with records. I still can't keep up with half my ghosts sometimes. Stupid speedy ghosts!

Anyway, maybe I'll take some videos to show what it looks like at my end. That probably gives a better explanation than my words.

Soccermums - Thanks for your observations, at least they make me a little more hopeful that my experiences of the update will improve.

i eat 20 mines at breakfast. After that, i drink a whisky, and then i **** 3 mini-freezes deep and i come right into lag's face.

those who are afraid of them are girlies !!!!!(no offence stinkleroy)
Wipeout : we race, we die, AND we are not afraid of small little insignifiant things like bugs.
When my ship is 0, on the verge of exploding, do you really think bug is something that shouldnt happen ? come on ! show your balls (or your tits) we're not playing football here ! if you dont have nerves to stand against bugs, then go and play curling !

and if you dont agree, then come on track and make me silent !! (ban is another solution though ...)

:)

@ SaturnReturn - I've had the mine issues as well, and I'm in the US.

@ chboing - :lol

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Originally Posted by SaturnReturn

I'm playing offline right now. One thing I've noticed is that you can't barrel roll at all if you're critical.

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Please tell me that's a joke :(

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Originally Posted by SaturnReturn

...Yeldar makes the point that he can't get close to his own times now. I don't think this is a lack of skill on his part.

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Originally Posted by stinkleroy

I haven't posted a single decent time since this update...has anyone?

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That's right I can't get anywhere near my times now, really ****ing me off.
Best time so far was a top20 on moa reverse. Not really surprising since there are no (standard) BRs on that track. The rest of my times have all been 75th(give or take a few) or worse.

Please fix my favourite game ever Studio Liverpool

Hehe chboing...no offense taken :p I wish I could video what was happening at my end though...then you'd see the slogan should just be '......we die' :lol

I like the idea of having not being able to BR when shields are critical, it was in Wipeout Pure so it's not some new tweak in the game that was just slapped on without any thought process.

(Speaking of Pure...oh, Xlink Kai, I still can't figure you out...)

i have never been able to BR when i was under 15 energy

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Originally Posted by Avenger2197

Ah right. it was getting a bit hostile in here for a while. Hmm, I wonder if a new thread detailing what we would want changed might be a good idea?

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Since this thread already details the things people are unhappy with and want changed, what would be the point of an essentially duplicate thread?

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Originally Posted by SaturnReturn

Soccermums - Thanks for your observations, at least they make me a little more hopeful that my experiences of the update will improve.

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Rest assured Saturn, if it turns out (lag aside) that the game-mechanic changes are intended, then I will be more whiny than all of you together :lol

I strictly play this game online only. There are even tracks where I haven't completed a single TT/SL offline, so this game is dead for me, if online doesn't get fixed (this also includes weapon balance, where the spawn distribution key seems off at the moment).

Right now though, I am giving them the benefit of the doubt :cake

before the patch : 0 record single race with glitch or cheat ...after : i can count 15 in all class with record 1 seconde ...nice patch :turd

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Originally Posted by chboing

i eat 20 mines at breakfast. After that, i drink a whisky, and then i **** 3 mini-freezes deep and i come right into lag's face.

those who are afraid of them are girlies !!!!!(no offence stinkleroy)
Wipeout : we race, we die, AND we are not afraid of small little insignifiant things like bugs.
When my ship is 0, on the verge of exploding, do you really think bug is something that shouldnt happen ? come on ! show your balls (or your tits) we're not playing football here ! if you dont have nerves to stand against bugs, then go and play curling !

and if you dont agree, then come on track and make me silent !! (ban is another solution though ...)

:)

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Cool to know that, mate ! You can count on me to try to give you your massive dose of mines ! :lol
Me too, i hope humor is not a reason to be banned !! :frown: ;)

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Originally Posted by Avenger2197

Ah right. it was getting a bit hostile in here for a while. Hmm, I wonder if a new thread detailing what we would want changed might be a good idea?

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Just reinforcing what lance said... that was kind of the idea when I made this thread in the first place :P

Another nuisance with the update: When I've highlighted a room I want to join, sometimes a new game will appear in the list the split-second I go to confirm my room choice, and suddenly I've picked a different room. New game-rooms shouldn't spawn between established rooms, they should either appear at the bottom of the list, or if they're going to appear further up, it shouldn't move your cursor.

You guys are right.;) I wasn't thinking clearly, my apologies. No sleep will do that to you.

AG-Wolf - That happend to me plenty even before the update. But I agree it's a little irritating. Not as much now that you can join games in progress though.