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feisar rocket
7th January 2012, 07:23 PM
Half-loop is deadly, half-loop rev is death...
The AI is good at rev for some reason... but fwd, they suck a*s. (im gonna record me playing half-loop today)

Who else downloaded FZEP?

Now there's two topics. FZEP and New WO. But if everyone gets FZEP we can share tracks easier, huh? Good for Zero, Xpand, and Aspect because they get a interactive 3d Image of the track (and they can edit!).

Xpand
8th January 2012, 12:36 AM
Here's something really cool to avoid huge terrain textures like I have in my cassandra track:
For this you just need small mosaic textures..
http://www.dxstudio.com/guide_content.aspx?id=053aadd0-0b13-45c3-b8a8-834f646015ba

MyNameIsBom
8th January 2012, 12:50 AM
Bom saw your zone ship, its like a Pure-HD hybrid...

thats a bad thing right? i tried to stay away from the HD look but i kept coming back to it somehow....
ive made 3 versions of it so far, the others have slight differences, eg. the ship is scaled properly, and the other one's "wings" is now attched to the body of the ship.

i might consider making another one, IF it is bad or it looks to fimilar to HD's

feisar rocket
8th January 2012, 12:56 AM
It depends...

MyNameIsBom
8th January 2012, 01:10 AM
well i kind of do like the look of the HD zone ship..... but ill try make another one. as for the tracks... i, at the moment, can only make them in GSK (google sketchup), so i will be making a zone track then.

@xpand/zero3growlithe hope you guys have GSK, its better then me drawing a track on a peice of paper, it will give you guys a clue of the elivations/heights etc. but i cant make walls, because it would be time consumng. does that sound good?

feisar rocket
8th January 2012, 01:51 AM
Im gonna make a zone track... with a pit lane :D... just in case ;)

and weapon pads... if its gonna be like HD (every track has a zone mode)

MyNameIsBom
8th January 2012, 02:05 AM
now the zone ship looks amazing!!!
@Xpand/Zero3growlithe what do u think of it?

feisar rocket
8th January 2012, 02:35 AM
Looks sweet!

I just started my track (starting area done - 11%)

Xpand
8th January 2012, 02:47 AM
Looks cool! A bit too blocky though. You should add more curves to that. It looks a bit too like the Fusion ships...

MyNameIsBom
8th January 2012, 02:54 AM
... A bit too blocky though. You should add more curves to that...

yeah, i didnt want too many poly in the ship, im trying to make it as simple as possible, but ok i can tune up the shape if you want me to

feisar rocket
8th January 2012, 03:28 AM
Is there any time scripting uses Hex?

Xpand
8th January 2012, 03:37 AM
yeah, i didnt want too many poly in the ship, im trying to make it as simple as possible, but ok i can tune up the shape if you want me to

Lol, but that's taking it way to far! We can handle up to 5000 polys... My solaris ship has around 1500/2000...

Killercrusher232
8th January 2012, 12:24 PM
now the zone ship looks amazing!!!
@Xpand/Zero3growlithe what do u think of it?

Try using a soften edges tool, that way it will do most of the work for you when you go to add more curves.

zero3growlithe
8th January 2012, 12:52 PM
@MyNameIsBom: (btw. Can I write just Bom?) Nice ship! Although it looks a little like hair dryer It's aerodynamically cool for Zone races ;) Just add some smooth lines to end of wings in exchange for flat surface or small hole and it'll be cool 8) How many polis it have?

btw. I've almost finished all features needed to start, play and end my game so next week I suppose I'll post it here... maybe with simple main menu if I'll get main things right fast :hyper I have design for it already in head so I just have to take my Bamboo Tablet and photoshop and do it.
EDIT: Oh, and i've fixed ALL things that has been criticised.
btw2. Xpand, your track waited so long for an update that trees grown there already xD
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/T9UBYfmC3cXRUY1_SoB6ypvKcBreqPaKGegrWrNQUJY?feat=d irectlink

Xpand
8th January 2012, 01:42 PM
lol, looks nice though they're oversized and you're placing them near sea water!!
Those trees aren't heavy? They seem like a whole lot of poly. Why don't you make the trees like in normal games? A plane with a tree texture?
But on the other hand, those sure look nice... A bit too big, but nice...

Killercrusher232
8th January 2012, 01:54 PM
you are going to make it an exe file aren't you?
also: The ultimate test - will my netbook (Intel Graphics Media accelerator) run this? :+

zero3growlithe
8th January 2012, 01:57 PM
One with leafs has 1400 polys... and they're oversized becouse they have to make shadows :g
@KillerCrusher: No idea, that depends on what Intel Graphic Accelerator u have and is this a 10" or 11" netbook i suppose. I'll check on my netbook xD

Xpand
8th January 2012, 02:02 PM
Well, this is what it was supposed to be like in the concept drawings:
2819
The track is supposed to be in the same environment as Vineta K.
I'm going to add buildings where some of the trees are...
But 1400 polys is a bit too much for a scenery object. Why not make the trees as two crossed planes with a tree texture?
But then again, Unity can handle it, probably...

Killercrusher232
8th January 2012, 02:03 PM
it's a 10.1 inch Emachines netbook with an Intel Atom N450 processor, 1GB memory, 160GB HDD and of course the Graphics Media accelerator.

But will it blend (with this game)?

zero3growlithe
8th January 2012, 03:17 PM
Uuuuu, i've just checked it on my netbook and I think that only half of it will blend with no trees, thrusts particles turned off and on 1024x600 resolution without lightning :redface: With all of those things I've deleted included maybe 1fps there would be possible xD Now it's something like 15 - 25fps. That doesn't surprises me...

Killercrusher232
8th January 2012, 03:21 PM
Sounds good so far... (it's strange, I have a modified version of the game Re-Volt. The mod is the HD Pro one, it's looks epic and it runs at max settings with no lag at all...)

Rotational_aspect
8th January 2012, 04:09 PM
Does Unity have a debug menu that shows the framerate and memory usage? You can use this to check relative performance- for example, on my wife's net-book my Python scripts use about 5% total processing time. whilst on my desktop (Quad core 3 ghz CPU plus GTX 460) processing time goes down to about 0.3%.

You may want to decide now what platform you want the game to run on, i.e. optimise the game for low end hardware or go crazy with eyecandy8). The main thing is the racing is smooth (constant framerate) otherwise high speed racing will be difficult if you have a 10 frame drop/ increase as you race.

Xpand
8th January 2012, 05:04 PM
Okay, so this is almost how Cassandra will look when complete.
I'm making this using photoshop only just for rapid prototyping of the lighting and building position:
2820
There are a lot of buildings left to be done...

zero3growlithe
8th January 2012, 05:13 PM
Sounds good so far... (it's strange, I have a modified version of the game Re-Volt. The mod is the HD Pro one, it's looks epic and it runs at max settings with no lag at all...)
And i have StuntGP, the best RC car racing game and it works too with no lag and i have no idea what's the difference between my game and this game but i'll do everything in my power to make my game work fast on my old, slow like hell, scrappy crappy Eee PC 1008HA :cowboy
@Aspect: Hmmm, there sure is such thing... I forgot about it :g
EDIT: Just checked stats and in the most requiring place it shows me:
Draw Calls: ~400
Tris: ~260 000
Verts: ~300 000
VRam Usage: ~20mb
60fps

Rotational_aspect
8th January 2012, 05:55 PM
Hmm.. you may want to make a build of the game just for testing- try it on different hardware. Perhaps you could code a FPS counter (for testing purposes) and people tell you what they get?

With Blender it tells me the percentage of system resources each part is using (which is handy!) so you may have a job seeing what is the bottleneck (if any). I'm guessing Unity requires a strong video card.

On other news, just finished my own node navigation script! It allows me to use any number of nodes in a track and will automatically sort the racers into race order....I can finally rest easy (I get annoyed with myself if these problems linger too long!). Maybe I will get to finish my game too8)

Killercrusher232
8th January 2012, 06:00 PM
Okay, so this is almost how Cassandra will look when complete.
I'm making this using photoshop only just for rapid prototyping of the lighting and building position:
2820
There are a lot of buildings left to be done...

Looking good man! :+

feisar rocket
8th January 2012, 09:31 PM
Intel Graphics Media accelerator run this?
I hope, my LGX12 uses it too.

Killercrusher232
9th January 2012, 09:52 AM
Note that my netbook's graphics media accelerator isn't a graphics card...

feisar rocket
10th January 2012, 02:43 AM
I know

zero3growlithe
10th January 2012, 04:10 PM
I'm having hard time while making "ships fire trails" right now as i have no idea on how to make them without using resource requiring particle emitters... The only thing I've found is Line Renderer (http://unity3d.com/support/documentation/Components/class-LineRenderer.html) which i suppose is the best way but site where I found script "Don'tGoThroughThings" just got hacked by spammers yesterday "this site (http://www.unifycommunity.com/wiki/index.php?title=DontGoThroughThings)" and i can't access code where something like late transform update was :cold
Any suggestions on how to make them? :|
EDIT: I have an idea, I'll just use switch function to place line renderer's coordinates (in depending on ship's speed time spaces) at the back of the ship alternately... I mean "if (Timer >= 0.3 [ms]), switch (lineRenderer[i.e index "1"] set coordinates on back of ship and then after next 0.3ms set point with index "2" and so on).... something like that...
EDIT2: Eeeeeh, it won't work...no, wait, It will work! :D

Killercrusher232
10th January 2012, 04:29 PM
can't you make it so that the area on fire emits an small animation made to look like fire, that shrinks quickly enough to stop the trail from becoming to long... (this is annoying and complicated to explain) think smoke trails, they are an image that always faces us, it's semi-transparent so it will darken with others behind/in front and it expands whilst fading (in some games at least)

Xpand
10th January 2012, 06:30 PM
Zero, you can make a static afterburner animated with thust vectoring nozzles:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrust_vectoring

It's more realistic than the ship trails like in wipeout since this system would be the one used to turn the ship, even when stopped.
In planes it's used for pitch, but if you turn the engine sideways you get yaw.
This is the F-22's engine:
2825

This can be easily done in a 3D program, you just have to make unity accept transparent materials and add a shine shader of sorts.

zero3growlithe
10th January 2012, 06:42 PM
Heeeeeee, so you guys are pointing to something more realistic, taken from real life :cowboy
btw. Check out those movies, I suppose we'll race in FX league in real life soon :hyper
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zqmdv5iyIOY&feature=player_embedded
After watching to answer question like: Whaaaat?!? How it's possible?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ws6AAhTw7RA&feature=player_embedded
Who said "WTF?" after watching it? :g

Xpand
10th January 2012, 06:52 PM
Lol, already saw those. Aparently the wipeout replica one is fake.
but the second one is quite feasible. I'm taking this university course so I can investigate those properties of supercooled objects in magnetic fields.
I said that above because it's easier to make those flames than using the lines inside unity. If unity supports texture alpha transparency and keyframed animations then you got the job done...

MyNameIsBom
11th January 2012, 12:45 AM
hey guys i just downloaded "Gmax", can someone explain to me what it basicly is? it looks similar to 3DS Max....

Xpand
11th January 2012, 01:22 AM
hey guys i just downloaded "Gmax", can someone explain to me what it basicly is? it looks similar to 3DS Max....

Don't use gmax. Use 3ds max. gmax can't export into any useable format unless you have a specific SDK for a game, which you don't for this one...
I have 5 years of experience with gmax due to the development of aircraft for FS2002/2004 (because gmax was the preferred platform to make the add-ons and there was a specialized SDK for it) and 2 years with 3DS Max 2008 for FSX. Gmax is the downgraded version of 3ds Max 5. Go with 3ds max, it has more tools and more export options.

feisar rocket
11th January 2012, 02:12 AM
I drew a zone ship at school today (and my friend was making fun of me at the same time...). I just need to find my camera...

Bom, anything new?

Zone track status [|¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦] (stolen from someone ;) )
Starting area status [|||¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦] (just got it's "place" with some detail)

P.S. School again, I won't be on every day now...
P.S.S. Again, with discriptions... How about track discriptions? Like in Pulse! (I can do it at school )

MyNameIsBom
11th January 2012, 03:39 AM
Don't use gmax. Use 3ds max. gmax can't export into any useable format unless you have a specific SDK for a game, which you don't for this one...
....Go with 3ds max, it has more tools and more export options.

right, ill stick with 3DS MAX for now, and uninstallling gmax now ;)


I drew a zone ship at school today (and my friend was making fun of me at the same time...)....

....Bom, anything new?...


lol dont worry feisar rocket, you are not the first person to get made fun of while drawing WipEout realated stuff :P

as for progress, i havent advanced much, ive been distracted alot lately, zoning in and out all the time, the next thing i know its 3am :brickwall :redface:. But ill try get back to work now 8)

ive made a 2D version of the zone track, (pic below) ,
and for the zone ship... i havent made any progress from it but will be making some changes to it now: the following primary change im trying to achieve is,
Smoother look for the ship, espicially the end of the wing. ( feedback from zero3growlithe, Xpand, and killercrusher232 suggests its rather "blocky" )

@zero3growlithe: yes you can just call me "Bom", and i hopefully everyone does too. :P

stay tuned for updates ( god this sounds cheesy xD )

UPDATES!!

- Changed the look of the main thruster, it is now HD like, a circle one, not that weird looking rectangle one :P (pic below)
- Zone Track, done, but only 2D, What the colours mean:
Black = Lowest in height
Drak-Grey = Second lowest height
and so on... so White will mean that the section of the track is at the highest point of the track.
(note for Xpand/zero3growlithe the height differences, between each section, doesn't have to be huge... but you guys can decide. )
- Secondary Thrusters have been moved closer to the main thruster ( Pic below )
- Ive rendered the new look of the thrusters and it looks AWESOME!!! ( definitely keeping the new look ) :hyper :rock ( Picture below )
- Coloured the thrusters, hope they look good :)

UPCOMING CHANGES!!

- Xpand/zero3growlithe will be taking over and continue thework of the zone ship, bcause ive hit a dead end. ( Refer to post #1040 )

Killercrusher232
11th January 2012, 09:02 AM
Looking good man! :+
The quote says it all

MyNameIsBom
11th January 2012, 11:29 AM
I have bascily hit a dead end, ive been trying to adjust the ZoneShip's shape but i kept getting the wrong results, i am rather limited to what i can do on google sketchup, and on 3ds max i havent even got the hang of it yet :/

So Xpand/zero3growlithe/anyone who is an advanced user of 3DS MAX or Blender(?), i will have to hand over the work, i have done so far, to you. the bit im stuck on is to adjust the ship and make it less "blocky", because i cannot unable to do it, as i said before i am limited to what i can do, but i hope i have done enough to help :)

the .DAE files are below, there are 2 version of the zoneship:
1. the based-on-WOHD design (filename: ZoneShipHDFury.zip)
2. and the not-so-based-on-WOHD-design (filename: ZonShipV3.3.zip)

both of them are kind of similar, but theyre slightly different

kei
11th January 2012, 07:46 PM
i am rather limited to what i can do on google sketchup, and on 3ds max i havent even got the hang of it yet :/

So Xpand/zero3growlithe/anyone who is an advanced user of 3DS MAX or Blender(?), i will have to hand over the work, i have done so far, to you.

Not to discourage you .. but your mesh(es) contain allot of double / hidden / unnecessary polygons. So it would take quite some time to clean them up before they can be considered game-ready and / or somebody can continue with them. Obviously, SketchUp is ( at least partially ) to blame ;)

Check out the following video to see some clean-up work on your mesh, so you can see a bit of the work involved.

http://youtu.be/eqm94mVtI4k

Rotational_aspect
11th January 2012, 08:50 PM
A design tip I was taught in college: never design on the computer.

What this means is finalise the design on paper first-the design should require no extra work once you start making the model.

If you are unsure of what shape your ship will take as you make it, start again on paper otherwise the design will be muddled and lack direction, as well as taking double the time to construct.

Xpand
11th January 2012, 09:03 PM
Yeah, Rotational is right.
For example, for the ships I usually do something like half of the top view and the side view:
http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2011/175/7/5/7515c12ef338c18c4a6e4901ad29bb5e-d3juodc.jpg
You can see the Solaris ship I made on the top...

zero3growlithe
11th January 2012, 09:15 PM
With drawing skill like yours Xpand, yes, but my skills for example are poor like hell and my concept drawing is so bad that final model would be better... but there sure is truth in Aspect's post if it comes to making models.
I can only paint some landscapes (http://zero3growlithe.wordpress.com/category/paintings-images/) and that's all if speaking of paper work :g

btw. Just finished my engines effects (looks realistic and better than WOHD's one although it totally different) thanks to your advices ;) I got timer working and showing next lap timer on new lap. Now I'm correcting ship physics [still, it's really hard to get everything right although it doesn't look like so] and planing to make finish race screen with place and times shown.

Xpand
11th January 2012, 09:27 PM
Oh, come on zero, it doesn't have to as detailed as mine. Just as simple outline of the shape of the ship should do it then just add the cockpit window where you wanted it to be...

zero3growlithe
11th January 2012, 10:13 PM
Outlined pictures of super strange ships with random details for example like this (https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/aeMPAJdIYI5sEXtsRbl90JvKcBreqPaKGegrWrNQUJY?feat=d irectlink). Any of them looks at least a little nice to make in 3D? :dizzy (i just don't want to make something useless again like my last tracks and ships ;) "too many poligons")

btw. Getting rid off those particles I had in my game speed up my game by at least 40% ^^:+

TrackEditor
11th January 2012, 10:32 PM
Deleted

feisar rocket
12th January 2012, 01:05 AM
Zone ship side views...

http://www.wipeoutzone.com/user_files.php?user_id=2531

It's 2 mb each, forcing me to use MyWZ...

MyNameIsBom
12th January 2012, 01:13 AM
Not to discourage you .. but your mesh(es) contain allot of double / hidden / unnecessary polygons. So it would take quite some time to clean them up before they can be considered game-ready and / or somebody can continue with them. Obviously, SketchUp is ( at least partially ) to blame ;)

Check out the following video to see some clean-up work on your mesh, so you can see a bit of the work involved.

http://youtu.be/eqm94mVtI4k

my bad :brickwall :brickwall :frown: i am quite new to this so yeah.... and half of the lines that i see on the ship, i didnt even make or see them before i exported it


A design tip I was taught in college: never design on the computer.

What this means is finalise the design on paper first-the design should require no extra work once you start making the model.

If you are unsure of what shape your ship will take as you make it, start again on paper otherwise the design will be muddled and lack direction, as well as taking double the time to construct.

about drawing on paper.... i am the world's absolute worst at that xD so i dont even bother, i just cant draw on paper :(
oh and thanks for the tip, ill use that for later.... if i ever do draw things on paper ;)


Yeah, Rotational is right.
For example, for the ships I usually do something like half of the top view and the side view:
http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2011/175/7/5/7515c12ef338c18c4a6e4901ad29bb5e-d3juodc.jpg
You can see the Solaris ship I made on the top...

Ill take that tip on board :)


thanks for the feedback everybody, although i kinda do fell a little discouraged.... oh well i'd get over it sooner or later :P

@feirsar rocket: the pictures are blurry and unviewable:/

Xpand
12th January 2012, 01:37 AM
Why are you limiting yourselves to basically use Wipeout as a full reference? Be creative, make several ships with more sources of inspiration other than wipeout. And then pick the one you like the most, improve it and post it. My ships are partly based on wipeout and partly in the aerodynamic properties of planes and partly from marine animals, mostly dolphins. But you can even look at star wars for inspiration...

MyNameIsBom
12th January 2012, 02:00 AM
....Why are you limiting yourselves to basically use Wipeout as a full reference? Be creative, make several ships with more sources of inspiration other than wipeout...

about that...... lol im actually not that creative :P but i will try to be next time.

and i now have nothing to do :/

Xpand
12th January 2012, 02:03 AM
Sorry for the double post...
So I've been working on some menu music and I'm quite enjoying this one:
http://kiwi6.com/file/66wwa1wso7
What do you think?
Keep in mind that it's like at 10% complete... I only added the main patterns. Still missing the variation patterns, plus the effects and stuff like that, plus correct some minor mistakes...
I'm used this game's soundtrack as inspiration:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brJTy6kseWY

MyNameIsBom
12th January 2012, 02:08 AM
So I've been working on some menu music and I'm quite enjoying this one:
http://kiwi6.com/file/66wwa1wso7
What do you think?


i actually quite like it :)

@TrackEditor: i hope you read this!!! i keep getting an error on the application "TrackEditor" (refer to attachted pic) how do i fix it?

feisar rocket
12th January 2012, 03:05 AM
...the pictures are blurry and unviewable:/

I know, it's just that it's night time... night mode sucks at night but at day, it's some se*y-ness...

EDIT, one of them are okay but idk if I uploaded it...

LOL WET-ness...

Xpand I love it on it's own (10% completed) . Sounds like a black menu with 3 ships racing in the background and one blows up... in a WO3 fashion! Pixelating lines = WO3 ?
Thats what I saw (imagined) with it until the piano comes.

feisar rocket
12th January 2012, 03:25 AM
... limiting yourselves to basically use Wipeout as a full reference...

(sorry for double post)

No, XGRA this time :D

Except armored bikes don't fly...

TrackEditor
12th January 2012, 10:18 AM
Deleted

Killercrusher232
12th January 2012, 10:35 AM
Here's an update of TrackEditor

What's new in v0.5?
- UI internal improvement
- Faster response time in subsection edit
- Minor bug fixes

So how in depth is this 'track editor' then?

Also i'm not sure XP can have the latest directx... you'll have to try and add some sort of compatability for us.

apemax
12th January 2012, 11:35 AM
@ Killercrusher: The latest DirectX for XP is 9.0c. I have XP and the latest DirectX and the track editor works fine on my computer. You can update to the latest version of DirectX using this installer:

http://www.microsoft.com/download/en/details.aspx?id=35

@zero3growlithe: I got a new desktop for xmas (3GHz CPU, 1.5GB ram, 214MB graphics crad.) so i tried the latest version of your game (Page 94, Post 937.) and it runs very smoothly. The lowest it got to was 50 fps. Also if you hit the barrier in the right way you can make your ship fly really high up and fall back down again.

Killercrusher232
12th January 2012, 11:37 AM
yeah, I checked afterwards. but now the problem is that track editor won't work because it can't find a specific file...

Rotational_aspect
12th January 2012, 06:08 PM
A few questions for zero:

Regarding your pathfinding, how are the ships moved? Are you using physics or simple delta location?

I am thinking about having various nodes that tell the ships what speed to do (i.e. this corners sharp, slow down to 20kph etc) but this only applies to the Bullet physics engine in Blender (without it the ships will crash on the first corner): if I use simple delta location the ships will never deviate from the path waypoints as delta location just teleports a shape from one place to another.

zero3growlithe
12th January 2012, 07:16 PM
Physics to make things easier, I'm moving them with proper force and pushing them away from walls when they're too close (it helps them navigating through sharp corners). To turn them... hmmmm, simple like hell method, when node is on the left of ship, HorizAxisInput = -1, and when opposite HorizAxisInput = 1, so it's same script for turning as for player's ship :g
(delta location..... eeeeeeeeeeh?)

@Xpand, {deleted} Nevermind, just in places where track is going down you can make walls higher. It would have made things easier a lot, becouse right now it is really easy to fall off the track when it's going down (on straight it's not possible for now ;))
If you don't want to, i can just make invisible walls there, hi hi :g
btw. This track looks awesome on image you attached some time ago :clap but don't abuse those lights or everyone's computers will explode :P

EDIT: I'll upload today my new version of game, It would be awesome if you guys could tell me what multiplier should I use for ship's max speed in game, becouse I don't know if it should be realistic or totally from space :dizzy :g
btw. Version with trees or without (for 3x better perfomance)? Version Hard or Easy?

Rotational_aspect
12th January 2012, 08:10 PM
I would start slow and simple, perhaps rapier speed?

If you put a high detail version up I can see how my GeForce 460 GTX handles things- I can take lots of pretty pictures though.....

Delta location is just a way to describe simple movement without physics. It just relocates an object a set amount in a certain direction. It causes problems as sometimes this teleporting goes into walls.

Out of interest, how do you tell a node is on the left or right? Rays /radar or mathmatically?

Killercrusher232
12th January 2012, 08:27 PM
If this sets my netbook on fire...

zero3growlithe
12th January 2012, 08:40 PM
@Killer: It won't :cowboy Fan will only start to rotate so fast becouse of heat that it'll shatter all components inside and eventualy get outside and shatter everything on its way so there is nothing to worry about.

@Aspect: To check on which side is my target I'm just converting it's transform.position from world coordinates to local and then I'm checking x-Axis of what I got. Function called InverseTransformPoint :+
About graphics, it is not so requiring as it looks like so it will work smooth. (but not on netbook! Mine, for instance, is not even handling Most Wanted on lowest settings! :brickwall)

btw. I'm just rebuilding node system from distance checking to trigger checking so I'll upload it in maybe 1h. (It'll be more accurate) EDIT: Oh, I suppose i have a little problem with that, so it can result in uploading it tommorow...what can be wrong with my script?!?... hmmmmm
As I thought, placing is working perfect, I just have to fix some bugs that appeared during "converting" and I'll upload it (tommorow)

feisar rocket
12th January 2012, 08:40 PM
If this sets my netbook on fire...

It's gonna set mine on fire too...

Or make my netbook use "self-destruct" like a pokemon according to Zero...

Xpand
12th January 2012, 10:57 PM
Okay, finished my selection screen music. If you, zero, or any one of you guys, want to make one yourself, we'll then choose what adapts more to the game. This music is a bit like the ones in the old racing games (SEGA GT/Early Grand Turismo series) with those menus with the cars silhouettes going by...
http://soundcloud.com/rbng-1/vivid

I'm now signing off untill next week...

Oh and zero, please remove the trees for now. You want to keep at least 25FPS of frame rate on low end computers...

MyNameIsBom
13th January 2012, 02:22 AM
@MyNameIsBom
Win 7 ???
Try to update your DirectX version
(See post #935)
It requires the latest DirectX 9.0c on 7

It says i already have the lastest version, and still the program wont start.... :brickwall

Killercrusher232
13th January 2012, 09:36 AM
@Killer: It won't :cowboy Fan will only start to rotate so fast becouse of heat that it'll shatter all components inside and eventualy get outside and shatter everything on its way so there is nothing to worry about.


If this makes my netbook fly away...

MyNameIsBom
13th January 2012, 11:39 AM
Wow great progress everyone! :D i am rather excited for the zonemode, while i wait i can play WipEout HD Fury on my brother's/my Ps3... but i dont have the disc from my friend yet :(

@zero3growlithe: remember that track you made for me a while back ago? if mag strips is possible then that track can be used :)

zero3growlithe
13th January 2012, 12:38 PM
My newest version of game just to make sure everything is working, so please tell me about everything you guys dislike :cowboy
https://rapidshare.com/files/2868527015/SlipStream_GX_Alpha.rar
- race can't be finished yet so don't get excited when first xD
- when last lap is done numbers go up anyway, but when I'll have finish screen done I'll change that
- to change version, in-game press "T" key for forest version or "R" key for normal version (loaded as default)
- shooting and destroying ships is available... but I won't tell you which key is for shooting :P
- related to above: when one of ships is destroyed placement system freezes... eeeeeh, I'll try to do something with it? :dizzy
- player's ship gravity is a little too small so I have to modify it a little later
Eeeeeeh, I think that's all... maybe I'll remember something later. (Oh, and this is easy version of game)
btw. It won't destroy your computers xD
EDIT: This is screenshot (https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/pwA2742jxMgwu-Y9yPf8KJvKcBreqPaKGegrWrNQUJY?feat=directlink) of my Task Manager showing perfomance on first version of game and second (only processor is shown though...)
My CPU is Dual Core 2.4GHz, but game is running on one core only (left inidicator on screenshot).

@Bom:
I don't have mag-strip done yet (i didn't even begin to make them), but I'll take care of it, don't worry :)
btw. What track do you mean? (there was some of them)

MyNameIsBom
13th January 2012, 12:44 PM
@Bom:
I don't have mag-strip done yet (i didn't even begin to make them), but I'll take care of it, don't worry :)
btw. What track do you mean? (there was some of them)

The one with Talons junction's Loop in it :P

PS> Zero3... My Norton internet security has gone haywire and mental. deleting all the files because it was "unsafe" and filled with "trojans" and "malwares"

What i dont like...
1. Tracks are way too skinny, or is it the ship has gotten bigger?
2. When you fall off the track and get respawned, you are always respawned backwards or facing directing at the wall.
3. energy loss.... i died on the 2nd corner, 1st lap btw. LOL
4. Still its really easy to jump out of the track, esspecially the last corner...

Xpand
13th January 2012, 01:15 PM
Lol, man. This is just too cool! The ship handles well, though it seems you got rid of the sliding. Feels a lot like Pulse, actually. 8)

Overall I think you're there!
One thing though, besides the respawn problem that Bom told. I managed to fly over half the track when I got airborne. Can't you use the Ray detector, that you use to align the ship with the track, to increase the gravity when you go flying off the track?
I will add invisible walls, though, but the increase gravity thing would be nice...

I guess now we just have to create environment sounds for the countdown and low energy and stuff like that... I can imagine the countdown like the WO2097 guy or the WO3 Curly...

zero3growlithe
13th January 2012, 01:23 PM
I had this gravity ray thing but it was too strong and "fast", so I have to make a little modified script which gradualy increases gravity while off-track so it won't be imediate and will look more naturally.
btw. Uploaded version with more energy and "change scene" thing repaired. It's in previous post.
And yeaaaaaaaaah, respawning sucks as I'm just too lazy to go through 23 nodes to change their rotation one by one... :g

MyNameIsBom
13th January 2012, 01:23 PM
I can imagine the countdown like the WO2097 guy or the WO3 Curly...

i made my own countdown noise ;)

so who is going to be brave enough to record there voice doing the countdown? xD

ehhh, the game doesnt start.... the countdown wont begin is what i meant

heres a pic of my CPU, seems like it makes it go kinda crazy...

and my computer's specifications....

Xpand
13th January 2012, 01:31 PM
Yeah, I guess we could just use beeps. You can do that fast in a sound editor...
But yeah zero, you're a hell of a programer! I would say that the basics of the game are done. Now its more bug fixes and adding visual and audio stuff to it. And the menus, must not forget about that! :D

Killercrusher232
13th January 2012, 01:42 PM
Can you put the game somewhere less likely to be filtered? (i'm at college, this may be my only chance to play because these computers are good)

zero3growlithe
13th January 2012, 01:44 PM
Doh, Photoshop, we need to meet again... I'll come with Bamboo Tablet.

@Killer: Where do you want it then?

MyNameIsBom
13th January 2012, 01:53 PM
@zero3growlithe, game wont start.... the countdown wont begin fo me :/
but yeah pretty much, as xpand said all the basic is nailed spot on or "close enough" *meme* (refer to picture below).

Killercrusher232
13th January 2012, 01:53 PM
Do you think you'd be able to get it on the forum?

zero3growlithe
13th January 2012, 02:21 PM
Hmmmm, It's Big, way to much according to WZ rules.
@ Bom: Just check it again or download it again, I'm sure it's working.
btw. Netbook Version (https://rapidshare.com/files/2482462873/Slipstream_GX_Netbook.rar) (works smooth on my netbook)
- excludes A.I

Killercrusher232
13th January 2012, 08:04 PM
Netbook version: Runs highest graphics with no lag

Normal version: Lags on lowest graphics, and having the trees on... that's suicide

zero3growlithe
13th January 2012, 08:41 PM
It sure is...
btw. I've spent some time to rotate those nodes so ship doesn't respawn facing wall or worse :brickwall

Xpand
13th January 2012, 08:57 PM
Oh, zero about the trees, don't mind about that. There's a much better way of making game trees that don't have a plane for each leave:
http://www.tconx.net/portfolio/tree/trees_003.jpg
This is an example...
There's also this type:
http://forum.unity3d.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=14252&d=1287565590

zero3growlithe
13th January 2012, 09:13 PM
Ahahaha, and how you think I've made those leafs... My time is precious enough to not make every leaf one by one. I've made them in Maya in 7min :hyper (this not rhinoceros, THIS IS SPARTA!!!.... i mean Maya xD)
But second one is not a bad idea :nod

Rotational_aspect
13th January 2012, 09:15 PM
Very nice! Everyone else has mentioned the problems but the basic game is there....well done!

Xpand
13th January 2012, 09:29 PM
Ahahaha, and how you think I've made those leafs... My time is precious enough to not make every leaf one by one. I've made them in Maya in 7min :hyper (this not rhinoceros, THIS IS SPARTA!!!.... i mean Maya xD)
But second one is not a bad idea :nod

Well, the trees you showed in that image with shadows were 1poly per leaf trees... There are two ways of making game trees and I put them there. The second one is the most common on wipeout and other racing games, except for rally...

zero3growlithe
13th January 2012, 09:41 PM
They look like this becouse of this texture:
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/hRxUskf889UJlxZzHpnkfJvKcBreqPaKGegrWrNQUJY?feat=d irectlink (it's small but it's enough)
(which I've made in photoshop too... how can i live without it)
Sorry if I offended you :redface:

Xpand
13th January 2012, 10:01 PM
LOL, why should I be offended dude! :)
Yeah, you're right. Then why do they weight so much? How many did you place?

zero3growlithe
13th January 2012, 10:02 PM
Maaaaaaany :g Tree (700 polis) + Leafs (700 polis). I didn't thought about placing them in game but when I was making it when bored I thought how it would have looked like in game as I've found fun thing in spot light options in unity. So I've imported this tree to Unity, placed it around track, used light to make this... light... coming through leafs, set-up animations for this light and some leafs and... you saw what I got xD Just playing around with proffesional tools :g

Rotational_aspect
13th January 2012, 11:32 PM
Has anyone used the tree generator in Unity?

Xpand
13th January 2012, 11:44 PM
Yeah, but they have too much detail for something that's going to only be seen passing by at high speed. If this game was like a rally game where you would have chance of getting in contact with the trees it would be acceptable using the Unity trees. I would go with the planar trees since they're easy to make and require very low processing to render them.

zero3growlithe
14th January 2012, 07:07 AM
I used it once too... it sucks :bat It takes too much time to make a simple tree so it's not worth of using (but if there is no other option then it can't be helped :g)

Xpand
14th January 2012, 06:41 PM
What? I make two planes in like 15 seconds. And another 30 seconds to place the tree texture! 8) Then I just copy them around the terrain.
In fact:
2838

This is exactly how they will look in-game. Do you need more than this for a simple scenery object that people don't even pay attention to? ;)

zero3growlithe
14th January 2012, 08:03 PM
(strains his eyes to spot trees on Xpand's image)
Hmmmmm, yeah, they don't notice them with this lighting, that's for sure :g Overall, after straining my eyes a little more I can notice really nice image of... hmmm, not sure what is that but I like this atmosphere 8)
EDIT: I have stuck my eyeballs into my screen and I recalled your... first track you've made I think? :blarg (Atlantica)

Xpand
14th January 2012, 09:01 PM
Yeah, it's Atlantica alright. I might have to remake the whole track section because I made a lot of irreversible mistakes while building it. Unlike Cassandra where I just had to place the texture on the track for it to be correctly textured, in Atlantica I had to texture every single section of the track, bit by bit and the corner textures don't align... and it's really frustrating...

Contemplating Atlantica again gave me an idea. What if the user could choose to race during the night? Like in the old NFS games?
Like, for example in atlantica. My initial idea was for a hot summer evening with a beautiful sunset seen from the resort where the protuding track section emerges from and hangs above the ocean from the cliff...
But seeing the track at night gave me that idea of night racing...
http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/4509/solarisatlantica.jpg

Rotational_aspect
14th January 2012, 10:26 PM
I want to race here:

http://boxofjack.com/files/blade-runner-los-angeles.jpg

It would be nice to have endurance races that went from evening into night...would the ships have navigation lights like aircraft?

Xpand
14th January 2012, 10:35 PM
Yeah, it would seem legit... And also headlights...

Oh and zero do you want cockpits for the ships, like in WO3?

zero3growlithe
14th January 2012, 11:03 PM
You mean for from-cockpit-camera ? If yes, then not really as I didn't like it...
@Aspect: If you want to race there... I'll check what I can do 8) It can be quiet fun to make it possible and then race on it :nod (I'm not kidding)

Xpand
14th January 2012, 11:42 PM
You sure? I can make them look more or less like this:
http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/269905_198386326879434_100001242030648_588641_8201 532_n.jpg
Only this is from one of my planes...

Also, you can have the clear view too. WO3 had it... It had cockpit, clear (just the track) and outside camera.

zero3growlithe
15th January 2012, 08:10 AM
(oh sh**, how did he do that?!?! That's awesome! Ok, keep cool...)
Woooo!!.. I mean.. ekhem, it doesn't look bad, yeah, maybe you're right with this cockpit view, it's ok :nod
EDIT: After modyfing it can be menu music... maybe: Enzimso (http://soundcloud.com/zero3growlithe/enzimso)

Xpand
15th January 2012, 03:52 PM
Only two more exams... Almost free...

feisar rocket
15th January 2012, 08:07 PM
Thats good Xpand!

Again, I drew a ship... based of Little Wavyern (James McLoud's F-Zero ship (KillCrush knows. Right?)

I talked to the principle on friday and now I can bring my netbook to school. Therefore, I get to learn Python, use S.Up, etc.

Rotational_aspect
15th January 2012, 08:52 PM
Xpand: but aren't your last two exams about quantum mechanics?

Zero: with some help from some Python Jedi I have made a similar system to your InverseTransformPoint- messing with vector dot products make my head spin- :cold

This does mean that I can have the possibility my vessels banking into turns now, something which bugged me before.

Xpand
15th January 2012, 09:09 PM
What, lol.
Nope, I have a linear algebra and analitic geometry (LAAG) exam monday and a introduction to physics (General physics, going from simple Newton's laws and wave mechanics to the laws of special relativity and introductory quantum physics) exam in thursday. I'll only have quantum mechanics next year... But I'll probably repeat the LAAG and Calculus exams because I'm pretty sure I've failed those... Lack of cold head during the Calculus exam and I'm going to fail LAAG due to only 4 days I had available for studying 3 months of stuff...

zero3growlithe
15th January 2012, 09:20 PM
@Xpand: Laag :g
@Rotational_Aspect: So u had to write it itself?!? wow, that sure is amazing! So JavaScript really is easy to learn...

Rotational_aspect
15th January 2012, 09:45 PM
zero3growlithe: The Python scripting in Blender is quite well developed- I just used a function that gets a normalised vector, and compared a local co-ordinate- if the co-ord is less than / more than 0 I can tell the ship to turn at that point.... I sort of understand the maths behind it..... just.

The above code replicates another built in function that automatically tracks to a point / object- however this is very basic and exact rotation values cannot be set (so, for example, I could not create a turn speed statistic for any ship using it).

EDIT: Thinking about it, banking might not be possible- I could do this in my 2D only version but with full 3D it might be difficult. Oh well, 1 out of 2s not bad!

EDIT 2: I may have a way of self righting (since this controls an object in 3d flight) sorted....fingers crossed! Also, I may have found another way to tell if the player is going the wrong way (and using significantly less system power!)- it uses the same principle as the AI steering: if the player has the target node as a vector, if its in front the x component will be positive, behind would be negative.... now just slap a print("wrong way!") beneath an if clause and bingo!

MiguelSkywalker
16th January 2012, 09:23 AM
Sorry to interrupt you, do you guys know Tracker 2000 software? it's made to design tracks for slot circuits, just to let you know in case it could be useful.

Killercrusher232
16th January 2012, 09:48 AM
Little Wavyern (James McLoud's F-Zero ship (KillCrush knows. Right?)


Lol, I only ever use The Skull's ship!

feisar rocket
16th January 2012, 02:08 PM
...you guys know Tracker 2000 software...

Not me, thanks for the info!

lil Wavyern is the best, except for it's low shields, it has good boost, grip, slide, and okay acceleration.

Xpand
16th January 2012, 10:18 PM
Started adding trees to the track... I might finish this one soon...

feisar rocket
17th January 2012, 03:04 AM
Looks nice, what are you using... 3dsM?

P.S. 300th post!!! YES

Xpand
17th January 2012, 03:27 AM
Yes. I'll have to remake the terrain texture though. It looks too cartoonish...

zero3growlithe
17th January 2012, 06:09 PM
I found good video on unity's site where you can find out something about acheving good perfomance in game. Although this one is for unity it can help with blender too.
http://unity3d.com/support/resources/unite-presentations/performance-optimization

Xpand
17th January 2012, 09:43 PM
Updated the track and terrain textures...
2841
2842

EDIT:
2843

MyNameIsBom
18th January 2012, 08:39 AM
Nice work Xpand! Loving the look :D

Xpand
18th January 2012, 12:36 PM
Thanks! I still need to make and texture a lot of stuff...
By the way zero, can you send me the environment map you used on this track? Just to see what I can do with it...

zero3growlithe
18th January 2012, 01:51 PM
It doesn't have to be this skybox textures which I've used... imo this one you've used is a lot better :cowboy
btw. Do you know how to make simple surface be visible from both sides? (excluding copying it two times)

Xpand
18th January 2012, 02:21 PM
Well, in 3ds max we have the "cap holes" modifier, but that's only good for flat surfaces. The best thing you can do it to copy it, flip the normals and then re-attach it to the original part. It won't have any thickness, though... What kind of part are you talking about?

zero3growlithe
18th January 2012, 02:40 PM
Ok, nevermind it, already found a way to do this, thx for reply :hyper
EDIT: Some pretty pictures of track with ugly flat trees xD
https://picasaweb.google.com/zero3growlithe/CassandraWTTrees?authuser=0&feat=directlink

Xpand
18th January 2012, 04:37 PM
So, umm, who's making the track? Me or you? :P Just kidding...

zero3growlithe
18th January 2012, 04:49 PM
I'm just killing time :P Making everything to have fun :hyper

Xpand
18th January 2012, 06:00 PM
Well, if you want the latest track just to update the game just tell me. If now I'll send it when it's done...

zero3growlithe
18th January 2012, 08:14 PM
Finish it and then you can upload it fully made so everything will be clear :)
btw. What does my ship looks like a bug? (every ship I've made so far in maya looked like a bug or worse xd)
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/xmAVL44gJvb2oyZ17fhe69MTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink (it's about 1000 polis model)
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/7AO8CCUtcI41Vets5XB459MTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/S4iTfIrhgPbML72ivTJq_NMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink
(even texture I've made suggests that it's bug [I can't help it that I like green color [pokerface] <- I want one now...])
Ship made in proportion two to one.

Rotational_aspect
18th January 2012, 08:58 PM
The ship does look like an insect, but its too low poly to get a good idea of its shape at the minute.

At certain angles (in the last picture) the silhouette is confused so I suggest you up the detail a bit more.

The texture pattern (which is nice) is fighting with the underlying model making it look messy. Is smoothing on too? If its not, switch it on and post some screens again.

OK crit over....sorry if it sounded negative! The above view (first picture) is a different story, the shape is well defined so you don't need much work there.

I've kind of hit a brick wall with the handling and guidance of my AI....:frown:

What I'm planning on now is a more pro-active system:

Applies an opposite force to combat side-slip.

Have nodes that have speed values, so on detection / touch the ship adjusts its own speed to match (say for example on sharp bends).

Have some form of primitive braking mechanism.

Its annoying to start again but its all a learning experience:)

Xpand
18th January 2012, 09:04 PM
Looks nice but what's that of the 2 to 1 porportion? Are you saying your ship is two times larger than it would be in real life?

zero3growlithe
18th January 2012, 09:42 PM
@Xpand: I mean that "lenght" of ship is 2*"width" of ship xD
@Aspect:
At certain angles (in the last picture) the silhouette is confused so I suggest you up the detail a bit more.
Don't know what you mean but I'll see what I can do... although I don't know what :brickwall (too stupid :donut__:donut)

Is smoothing on too? If its not, switch it on and post some screens again.
Eeeeeeh... with it on it looks like a real insect :cold Even monster!
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/mAaZiKLwQ6bCJfLEKFMYDdMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/Po3a_FrN9v7wrzrC52O_qtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/M7MJrmKz3AvcS7yrYlPLvtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink
(oh, and don't look at poli count there as i'm in preview mode...)
btw. I've just noticed that this not smooth one looks like transformers from "up" view xD

Xpand
18th January 2012, 09:55 PM
Oh man, be careful with the mesh smooth/subdivision. That's a really good tool for animation movies, for games, however, it is the worst thing you can use because you won't have control over the amount the polys of your model... I got told this by a professional 3D modeler that made models for Need For Speed Underground. It's a royal pain in the a$$ when you realise that you've added too many polys and now the games runs at 3 FPS. :brickwall
Didn't the document about game optimization talk about that? :eek

Remember, just an advice... ;)

Rotational_aspect
18th January 2012, 10:03 PM
OK, more crits:

I would suggest using smoothing groups (I don't know the equivalent Maya term is). With low poly stuff this will help add definition.

Create creases in areas to define sharp edges (like wings). This is kind of a halfway house between no smoothing and all smoothing.

Check this out (just as a quick example for Blender) to see what I mean.

http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?61087-Smoothing-groups-mini-tut.

Xpand
18th January 2012, 11:06 PM
Blender does that in a strange manner. And after months of trying I still can't get that result without having to separate the parts.
In 3DS Max you just add the smooth modifier and click auto-smooth and presto! it's done...

Rotational_aspect
19th January 2012, 12:19 AM
Xpand: yes it is a bit strange in Blender (coming from a Max background). The thing to remember is the Blender Game Engine plays nice with stuff made in Blender (including separating meshes) that would screw up in other 3D engines.

This is to say Blender won't get this feature in the future.

Another good tutorial (for Blender):

http://www.katsbits.com/tutorials/blender/sword-mesh-smoothing.php

Dayviewer
19th January 2012, 12:51 PM
Hey guys this looks great what you all have here so far! :)
I could give you a hand in modeling and texturing if you guys want, heres one of my latest models: http://m.cmcdn.net/13619617/780x438.jpeg
I have very little experience with Unity though but i do have experience with UDK

Rotational_aspect
19th January 2012, 04:57 PM
yes!!!

Finally got something working!!!!:g I have finally managed to get the racers to use physics (rather than basic motion) reliably!

I made a small script that takes the linear velocity of each axis, and if an axis goes over a threshold (e.g. the z /up axis goes above 1) an opposite force is applied, meaning no ship flies into nowhere when they overshoot.... think Homeworld (PC game) for motion and you are not far removed from what I have at the minute. I am currently testing a 'worst case' track and see if I can force any problems.

And since these values can be altered, it means it can form a stat for ship handling (higher == tighter manoeuvring, lower == sloppy).

So far, I can also alter how close to a node the AI has to be before it looks for the next node- the start of difficulty settings?

The other great thing is so far these scripts are running needing very few resources. With six racers the drain is about 1%- this will probably go to about 2% with eight to ten racers.

And hello/welcome to Dayviewer- I'm sure Xpand/Zero will have some modelling to do at some point.....as for me, I'm still piloting cubes around!

zero3growlithe
19th January 2012, 06:31 PM
I need to modify my script too becouse:
1. It's really messy
2. It takes a lot of cycles to go through so it works slow if used many times (too many raycasts is there too... and I thought that colliders are more expensive)
Anyway, I hope to see your version of game someday becouse it's beggining to sound more and more interesting :nod
EDIT: Can they already run on track which has changing height?
@Dayviewer: Woooooo, damn it that I didn't know that Unreal Engine is now free to use earlier :| But there is other side of the medal... 3 versions of one game, lol, which one will be better: Blender, Unity or Unreal Engine one? :g (of course if you want to try to make one)

Xpand
19th January 2012, 06:34 PM
Hey guys this looks great what you all have here so far! :)
I could give you a hand in modeling and texturing if you guys want, heres one of my latest models: http://m.cmcdn.net/13619617/780x438.jpeg
I have very little experience with Unity though but i do have experience with UDK

Wow, that's cool! You have any idea of how to make something that looks like an AG ship? Or even tracks? :g

Dayviewer
19th January 2012, 06:53 PM
@Dayviewer: Woooooo, damn it that I didn't know that Unreal Engine is now free to use earlier :| But there is other side of the medal... 3 versions of one game, lol, which one will be better: Blender, Unity or Unreal Engine one? :g (of course if you want to try to make one)It's been for some time ;) anyway Unreal is absolutely great, you can set up a great scene in no time, i worked on this one with 3 other guys recently:
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/7950/eindresultaat.jpg
Post office i made for it:
http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/7922/postofficew.jpg
I don't know anything about programming stuff in there though, Unity is great as well very open and easy to use, though definatly harder to get a better rendered result.


Wow, that's cool! You have any idea of how to make something that looks like an AG ship? Or even tracks? :g
Thanks! yea i could definatly try a ship or some track work like buildings/billboards and stuff like that ^^
I work in 3ds max and can supply you guys with all kinds of exports and texture maps ofcourse, if you decide to try out UDK i can help out getting all the meshes in there and setting up the scene rendered nicely :)

Xpand
19th January 2012, 07:03 PM
Hey, does Unreal use C/C++? Cause I'm way better at those than C# or Java...

Rotational_aspect
19th January 2012, 07:04 PM
My next task is to make a braking system (easy enough in part since its the same system as what I have now, just on the y (forward) axis)- the big question is how I trigger it. I did have a brainwave for making waypoint nodes hold 'speed limit' data, but it may be a case of experimentation;)

As far as Blender goes (I assume Unity too), rays / radar functions are CPU costly- have you thought about using a system similar to mine which uses references to the objects linear velocity? My AI uses no rays (yet;)) and it seems CPU friendly so far (but then......I have no eye candy yet!). Here is my blender script:



import GameLogic

cont = GameLogic.getCurrentController()

own = cont.owner

Xspeed, Yspeed, Zspeed = own.getLinearVelocity(True)

Anti_L_slip = [ -200.0, 0.0, 0.0]

Anti_R_slip = [ 200.0, 0.0, 0.0]

Anti_UP_slip = [ 0.0, 0.0, -120.0]

Anti_DOWN_slip = [ 0.0, 0.0, 120.0]

local = True

if Xspeed > 1:

own.applyForce(Anti_L_slip, local)

if Xspeed < -1:

own.applyForce(Anti_R_slip, local)

if Zspeed > 1:

own.applyForce(Anti_UP_slip, local)

if Zspeed < -1:

own.applyForce(Anti_DOWN_slip, local)


Its really basic but it works, and it may be of some help to you. The only other option would be to lower the time the script is run per second (in Blender this is called frequency). The only problem with this is that some things need to be done constantly (like steering!) whilst others (like race positions) can be done ten times a second/game tick rather than 60.

And I too hope my game gets finished! As a hobby Blender (and making games) is fun but its nice to see something work at the end of it all!

Dayviewer
19th January 2012, 07:08 PM
Hey, does Unreal use C/C++? Cause I'm way better at those than C# or Java...
http://udk.com/features-scripting.html
C++, Java, Unrealscript, and Kismet but thats more of a visual way like Game Maker

zero3growlithe
19th January 2012, 07:49 PM
Wow... so simple and effective :O My A.I script looks something like this: (maybe I'll put it as txt file?)
(It steers ship up, down, left, right and what not other direction you imagine but it's heavy...yeeeeeees, very heavy :g Although I don't know how to check that)
EDIT: Yeeeaaaah... now i know how to check perfomance.... here (http://unity3d.com/support/documentation/Manual/Profiler.html)...I love how it says "pro only"

var RaceBeginnerEnemy : boolean = false;
var SlowDown : boolean = true;

// Ship stability
var STRearRayOffset = Vector3(0,1,8);
var STBackRayOffset = Vector3(0,1,-5);
var STRearRayDir = Vector3(0,-1,-0.3).normalized;
var STBackRayDir = Vector3(0,-1,-0.3).normalized;
private var STRayLenght : float = 2.4;
private var StabilitySpeed : float = 140;
var layerMaskST : LayerMask;
// Ship gravity manipulator
private var AGforce : float = 40000000;
private var AGforceRay : float = 1.5;
private var HitDistMultiplier : float = 50;
private var PushUpForce : float = 300;
private var Gravity : float = 1000000;
private var GravityRayLenght : float = 1.6;
var AGlayerMask : LayerMask;
private var GravityRayOffset = Vector3(0,0,4);
// Ship Energy
var ShipEnergyVar : float = 100.0;
var Destroyer : GameObject;
private var SERayLenght : float = 0.4;
// Particle Emitters
var LeftSparks : ParticleEmitter; var RightSparks : ParticleEmitter;
var FrontSparks : ParticleEmitter;var LeftSparksE : ParticleEmitter;
var RightSparksE : ParticleEmitter;
// PE offsets
var LeftRay = Vector3(-3.8,-1,-2.6);
var RightRay = Vector3(3.8,-1,-2.6);
var FrontRay = Vector3(0,-1.5,9.5);
// PE directions
var LeftRayDir = Vector3(-0.3,-0.1,-1).normalized;
var RightRayDir = Vector3(0.3,-0.1,-1).normalized;
var FrontRayDir = Vector3(0,1,0.2).normalized;
// Layer mask
var SElayerMask : LayerMask;
// Turning and Moving
private var speed : float = 2400000;
private var horizAX : float = 0;
var horizSpeed : float = 2;
var horizAngle : float = 15;
private var turnSpeed : float = 160;
private var hBank : float = 0;
var dir1 = Vector3(-1,0,0).normalized;
var dir2 = Vector3(1,0,0).normalized;
var Hit : RaycastHit;
var layerMask2 : LayerMask;

private var Node : float = 1;
private var LastNode : float = 0;
private var FullLap : float = 21;
private var Lap : float = 0;
var CheckActualPlace : float = 0;

function OnCollisionEnter(CollisionDetct : Collision){
if (CollisionDetct.gameObject.name == "CannonBullet"){
ShipEnergyVar -= 2;
}
}
function OnTriggerEnter (NodeTrigger : Collider){
var NodeString : String = Node.ToString();
if (NodeTrigger.gameObject.name == "StartGate"){
SlowDown = true;
}
if (NodeTrigger.gameObject.tag == "FinishLine" && FullLap > 18){
Lap ++; Node = 1; LastNode = 0; FullLap = 0;
}
if (NodeTrigger.gameObject.name == NodeString){
Node ++; LastNode ++; FullLap ++;
}
}
function OnTriggerExit (CheckGate : Collider){
if (CheckGate.gameObject.name == "StartGate"){
SlowDown = false;
}
}
function Update(){
if (RaceBeginnerEnemy == true && SlowDown == false){
ShipTurning();}

if (LastNode > 23){LastNode = 0;}
if (Node > 23){Node = 1;}

NavigateShip();
ShipEnergy();
}
function FixedUpdate(){
ShipAntiGravity();
SideForce();
ShipStability();
}

function NavigateShip(){
if (GameObject.Find("GameController").GetComponent("RaceSequencer").StartTimerEnd == true){
RaceBeginnerEnemy = true;
}
var NodeString : String = Node.ToString();
var LastNodeString : String = LastNode.ToString();

Target = gameObject.Find(NodeString).transform;
LastTarget = gameObject.Find(LastNodeString).transform;

var LastNodeDistance : float = ((Vector3.Distance(LastTarget.position, transform.position))/ 100);
var DistanceFromFinish : float = ((Lap * 100) + LastNode + LastNodeDistance);
CheckActualPlace = DistanceFromFinish;

var SideCheck = transform.InverseTransformPoint(Target.position);
if (SideCheck.x < -10.0){horizAX = -1;}
else if (SideCheck.x > 10.0){horizAX = 1;}
else {horizAX = 0;}
}
function ShipTurning (){
transform.Rotate(0, horizAX * turnSpeed * Time.deltaTime, 0, Space.World); // Rotate ship left/right
hBank = Mathf.Lerp(hBank, horizAX, Time.deltaTime * horizSpeed); // Restricted Z-Axis variable for read-only
var CurrentAngle = transform.localEulerAngles; // Variable for Z-Axis Angle in degrees
CurrentAngle.z = -hBank * horizAngle; // Change that variable
transform.localEulerAngles = CurrentAngle; // Set ships rotation according to this variable
}
function ShipStability (){
if ((Physics.Raycast (transform.TransformPoint (STRearRayOffset), transform.TransformDirection (STRearRayDir), Hit, STRayLenght, layerMaskST)) && Hit.distance > 0.1){
transform.Rotate (Vector3 (-StabilitySpeed / Hit.distance,0,0) * Time.deltaTime);
}
if ((Physics.Raycast (transform.TransformPoint (STBackRayOffset), transform.TransformDirection (STBackRayDir), Hit, STRayLenght, layerMaskST)) && Hit.distance > 0.1){
transform.Rotate (Vector3 (StabilitySpeed / Hit.distance,0,0) * Time.deltaTime);
}
}
function SideForce(){
if (RaceBeginnerEnemy == true && SlowDown == false){
rigidbody.AddForce(transform.forward * 1 * (speed * 3) * Time.deltaTime);
// Keep ship in the middle of the track
if (Physics.Raycast (transform.position, transform.TransformDirection (dir1), Hit, 2, layerMask2)){
rigidbody.AddRelativeForce (1 * (700000 * 3) * Hit.distance * Time.deltaTime,0,0);
rigidbody.AddForce (0,0, 400000 * 3 * Hit.distance * Time.deltaTime);
//transform.Rotate (0,40 * Time.deltaTime * Hit.distance,0);
}
if (Physics.Raycast (transform.position, transform.TransformDirection (dir2), Hit, 2.5, layerMask2)){
rigidbody.AddRelativeForce (-1 * (700000 * 3) * Hit.distance * Time.deltaTime,0,0);
rigidbody.AddForce (0,0, 400000 * 3 * Hit.distance * Time.deltaTime);
//transform.Rotate (0,-40 * Time.deltaTime * Hit.distance,0);
}
}
}
function ShipAntiGravity(){
Speed = transform.rigidbody.velocity.y * 3.6;
if(Physics.Raycast(transform.position, transform.TransformDirection (Vector3.down), Hit, AGforceRay, AGlayerMask)){
rigidbody.AddForce (Vector3(0,(AGforce * 3) / (Hit.distance * HitDistMultiplier),0) * Time.deltaTime);
}
if((Physics.Raycast(transform.position, transform.TransformDirection (Vector3.down), Hit, 0.4, AGlayerMask)) && -Speed > 25){
rigidbody.AddForce (Vector3(0,PushUpForce,0), ForceMode.Impulse);
}
if(!Physics.Raycast(transform.TransformPoint (GravityRayOffset), transform.TransformDirection (Vector3.down), Hit, GravityRayLenght, AGlayerMask)){
rigidbody.AddForce (Vector3(0,-Gravity,0) * Time.deltaTime);
}
}
function ShipEnergy(){
// Collision detection for wings and bumper
if (Physics.Raycast (transform.TransformPoint (LeftRay), transform.TransformDirection (LeftRayDir), Hit, SERayLenght, SElayerMask)){
LeftSparks.emit = true;
LeftSparksE.emit = true;
} else{LeftSparks.emit = false; LeftSparksE.emit = false;}
if (Physics.Raycast (transform.TransformPoint (RightRay), transform.TransformDirection (RightRayDir), Hit, SERayLenght, SElayerMask)){
RightSparks.emit = true;
RightSparksE.emit = true;
} else{RightSparks.emit = false; RightSparksE.emit = false;}
if (Physics.Raycast (transform.TransformPoint (FrontRay), transform.TransformDirection (FrontRayDir), Hit, SERayLenght, SElayerMask)){
FrontSparks.emit = true;
} else{FrontSparks.emit = false;}
// Ship destroyer
if (ShipEnergyVar <= 0){
Instantiate (Destroyer, transform.position, transform.rotation);
Destroy (gameObject);
}
}
btw. Is there a way to make this window with text above smaller?
Oh, btw. If you have something like taging in blender you can just make script which detects when node is tagged i.e "slow down" and change speed to lower in that case.

Rotational_aspect
19th January 2012, 09:36 PM
Thanks for the tip Zero- Blender does not have that (very useful- I'm jealous!) ability. I can do something similar by giving an object a property and then creating a list that looks for said property.

Although I don't use it, Unity sounds very well developed with a lot of useful tools.

feisar rocket
20th January 2012, 02:18 AM
Sorry for killing the script-ness, I'm at chapter 3 for python tuts... making simple scripts with many errors.

In Grade 10-12, I get to learn C, java and Python!

Good luck!

now SAA IKOUZE!!! (jap for, lets go)

Xpand
20th January 2012, 08:56 PM
Thanks! yea i could definatly try a ship or some track work like buildings/billboards and stuff like that ^^
I work in 3ds max and can supply you guys with all kinds of exports and texture maps ofcourse, if you decide to try out UDK i can help out getting all the meshes in there and setting up the scene rendered nicely :)

Well, I'd recomend that you make ships.. since we're a bit short on those. After having all of them made we can start thinking about the billboards and ads. And can you also come with racing track ideas? Though, not something too wacky! :g
When I'm done with this track I'll ask you to enhance the textures if you think that's needed:
2847
But please take in mind that this is a very early WIP. I'm going to add more detail...

Dayviewer
20th January 2012, 09:28 PM
Ok cool sounds great!, when you got that track finnished i'll definatly take a look at it for improvements if possible ;) yea i already started sketching some ship ideas today and i'll start the first one tommorow.
Will post some track ideas when i have some ofcourse :D

feisar rocket
20th January 2012, 10:50 PM
This is just a information post, just trying to clear something up.
so far;

Game versions: two (3dsM and Blender)
Texture artists: Day, me (possibly), Xpand.
Ship designers: me, Bom, Xpand, Zero, (eventually) Day
Track designers: Xpand, Bom, Zero
Coders: Zero, (idk about Xpand), Aspect.
Track information (like in pulse): Me (so far...)
Ship information (like in pure): Me (so far...)
Music: Xpand, Zero
In-game ads/ billboards: Day
Tester: EVERYONE!

I got everything and everyone right?

Aspect, when I learn Python, I'll go onto Blender with you.

P.S. Thanks for info Xpand, anything new Bom?

Xpand
20th January 2012, 11:03 PM
zero also makes ships and music... We'll have to make a selection of the musics to use after the basic game is complete.

zero3growlithe
20th January 2012, 11:27 PM
Slow down mate, I can't even tell that my game is basic game at it's state as now I'm rebuilding (again) A.I to not use raycasts and player's ship to be more stable and easier to set-up :cowboy So much to do....

feisar rocket
20th January 2012, 11:30 PM
But the possibility is high, all games have the Alpha stage and patches to be made, huh?

Xpand I mean the possibility of a game for 3dsM is high. Not a full release. We need both versions to be cleaned and ready for one.

Xpand
20th January 2012, 11:40 PM
Yeah, but why would we release the game knowing about the bugs? The patches are for correcting bugs/glitches that were only known after release...

Killercrusher232
21st January 2012, 09:29 AM
Just a question, what year is this game set in? (knowing this will help for adverts and props etc)

Dayviewer
21st January 2012, 10:20 AM
That would definatly help too ^

And why a 3ds Max and Blender version? i know Blender is an engine as well so you can make a game with that but what you can't make a game with 3ds max, only the models which then need to go in Blender, UDK or Unity , or am i missing something here? :|

Anyway work in progress :D
http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/900/76208747.jpg
If you guys think the cockpit is blocked too much from the rest considering the view i have some other ideas for it just tell me ;)

Xpand
21st January 2012, 11:40 AM
Well, the Blender version is a completely different game from what we're doing inside the AG racing game category. Aspect is developing that one and we share ideas on the programing since they work in a similar way. 3ds max is for the Unity engine.
Oh and that ship is looking pretty nice. You have taken a look at the ones we have haven't you?
If not:
http://th03.deviantart.net/fs70/PRE/f/2011/332/b/5/solaris_nose_by_threedmaniak-d4hkqp9.jpg
and the current testing ship. This one will recieve a lot of modifications...
2848

We'll then have to discuss if the ships should have an inside cockpit view...

Dayviewer
21st January 2012, 12:02 PM
Aah ok got it :D
Thanks! well i only saw the green insect looking one and the testing ship so far which look great ^^, how many others are allready made?
A cockpit view would be awesome, is that actually ever done before in the series i think not? Would make my ship pretty hard to pilot though haha :P

Xpand
21st January 2012, 12:04 PM
We only have these and one from zero, that he's still making. The cockpit view was around in WO3, but it never took of, though I sometimes like flying the ship inside the cockpit. You can go back about 5 or 6 pages back in the thread to see more or less where we're at...

Killercrusher232
21st January 2012, 12:05 PM
http://media.gamerevolution.com/images/games/sony/wipeout_3/wipeout_3_002.jpg
WipEout 3's cockpit view

Xpand
21st January 2012, 12:08 PM
It had more detail than that:
http://www.the-nextlevel.com/reviews/playstation/wipeout3/wipeout33.jpg

Also, if you guys want you can leave the skype contacts if you have them. It would be easier to talk through there. Mine's "ricardo.xpand".

F.E.I.S.A.R
21st January 2012, 12:13 PM
Does anyone know where jese7095(or similar) went?

As for time the game is set in...there are a few possibilities:
-Pre FX300
-Post FX400/Post 2212


Does anyone have the league designation? Would FX-600 be an option to consider?

Dayviewer
21st January 2012, 12:27 PM
Ah didn't know WO3 had it, only played that one for a few minutes though haha!
Anyway yea i looked back a few pages and looking good, impressive stuff on that build as well very cool to play already :D
I could definatly help on improving the track textures too if you guys want.
How many polys and texture space for the ships btw? right now i'm on 245 polys

Xpand
21st January 2012, 12:50 PM
I think 3000 polys for ships is enough. Unity can handle much more than that, but I think 3000 is the optimum amount. The texture size for ships, I'm using a 1024x1024 texture sheet for the whole ship.
The track textures in that build are basic. I added a lot more detail now... When I'm done with the track I'll send it to you and zero to see if you guys want to improve anything..

zero3growlithe
21st January 2012, 12:53 PM
My insect's policount says: IT'S OVER 1000!
btw. I'm already testing it on Xpand's track and it doesn't look so bad when moving so I think it's not the end of the world for him xD

Dayviewer
21st January 2012, 12:58 PM
ok sounds good ^^ i'll continue on the ship now and i'll post updates when i have them ;)

F.E.I.S.A.R
21st January 2012, 01:11 PM
Has anyone come up with the background "story" for the "WipEOut Ïnstallment"?

feisar rocket
21st January 2012, 01:30 PM
No, I hear you're a fan fiction guy!

The closest to it we have to that is, me making Ship comments like in Pure, and Track stories like in Pulse.

The only reason I didn't start is because "we need more work to be done." Right, Xpand?

Time: FX-150 because the amature leagues had no set teams, and a foundation for a story.

Xpand
21st January 2012, 01:33 PM
Yeah feisar, that's right...
But I like the amateur league idea. You probably can start to write some background story ideas. Though without naming any of the teams yet... :g

F.E.I.S.A.R
21st January 2012, 02:32 PM
I wonder where Challenger went,though...

Any tracks NOT set on Earth?

What I'm thinking of as of now:

The Fall of the F9000 Anti-Gravity Racing League in October 2170 crippled Anti-Gravity Racing to its knees,only kept alive by the hardcore fanatics racing in custom craft on makeshift circuits around the world during the global Depression. The 2185 Anti-Gravity Purity Festival celebrating the 150th Anniversary of the first AG Flight(and Pierre Belmondo's crashed/destroyed vision) reignited global furore for Anti-Gravity Racing. Makeshift circuits were converted into sanctioned tracks. Funding for Anti-Gravity Racing (and Anti-Gravity technologies in general) have increased exponentially. Teams have emerged,turning fan groups around the world to amateur team outfits with funds from their governments.
From the ashes of the F9000 comes the FX-150 Anti-Gravity Racing league,back with a Vengeance.A new age of Anti-Gravity Racing is born...

Killercrusher232
21st January 2012, 02:42 PM
GX Silence Stadium (see what I did there?)
http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/0/498/262874-ss11_super.png:g

F.E.I.S.A.R
21st January 2012, 02:48 PM
@KillerCrusher:No. What DID you do?

Rotational_aspect
21st January 2012, 02:51 PM
Mini update:

Although I am really playing catch-up with Zero (who has already done this), I have modified the race position readout to read like 2/3 rather than have a list of racers.

As far as scripting and patching problems: its best to code things right the first time- sometimes you have to start from scratch and rewrite things using what you've learned, rather than try to amend things later as it gets messy and disorganised.

Dayviewer: I like the direction your ship is going in!

Killercrusher232
21st January 2012, 02:51 PM
Never played F-Zero X?

F.E.I.S.A.R
21st January 2012, 03:04 PM
@Killer:Yes,I did,but I still am not sure what you did

Dayviewer
21st January 2012, 03:33 PM
Ship model finnished:
http://img840.imageshack.us/img840/9532/76545270.jpg
1055 polys / 1914 tris.
Now off to unwrapping, hope to have it finnished and good to go by tommorow :)


What I'm thinking of as of now:

The Fall of the F9000 Anti-Gravity Racing League in October 2170 crippled Anti-Gravity Racing to its knees,only kept alive by the hardcore fanatics racing in custom craft on makeshift circuits around the world during the global Depression. The 2185 Anti-Gravity Purity Festival celebrating the 150th Anniversary of the first AG Flight(and Pierre Belmondo's crashed/destroyed vision) reignited global furore for Anti-Gravity Racing. Makeshift circuits were converted into sanctioned tracks. Funding for Anti-Gravity Racing (and Anti-Gravity technologies in general) have increased exponentially. Teams have emerged,turning fan groups around the world to amateur team outfits with funds from their governments.
From the ashes of the F9000 comes the FX-150 Anti-Gravity Racing league,back with a Vengeance.A new age of Anti-Gravity Racing is born...Sounds awesome! :g

Xpand
21st January 2012, 04:10 PM
Freakin' awesome! And fast too! Did you make the ship in acceptable sizes? like in a realistic scale? For example, my ships are all inside the 10-20 meters length.

F.E.I.S.A.R
21st January 2012, 04:20 PM
Would anyone here be willing to convert a "Blueprint" 2D ship to 3D?

And has anyone seen jese7905? My track is just staying in limbo :|

Rotational_aspect
21st January 2012, 04:28 PM
Very cool ship! Bit of a speed modeller Dayviewer:twisted

Another update: I have a very crude auto-brake working. Each ship has a radar (told you Zero I would have rays/ radar at some point;)) that can detect a nodes property.

So for example, node may have the property value of -50 and this value would be used in the forward axis to brake. It has flaws, but its a start!

Killercrusher232
21st January 2012, 04:28 PM
GX Silence Stadium
Slipstream GX is what the game is currently called

Silence is the second track in F-Zero X

It's like a Nascar stadium, but it's on the moon (hence the name Silence)

A stadium track would be great for max speed racing

F.E.I.S.A.R
21st January 2012, 04:32 PM
Wait...we've already decided on a name for this 'installment'?

Xpand
21st January 2012, 04:47 PM
Well, zero named the executable file thusly... Guess we'll have to ask him if that's a definitive name...

zero3growlithe
21st January 2012, 05:15 PM
Well, I like this name but it can be changed still as I didn't begin to make menus yet :nod

Killercrusher232
21st January 2012, 05:36 PM
I did some research and it seems this game sneaks in before WipEout Pure, which is annoying as there aren't any adverts to use as reference for adverts in this game's period...

feisar rocket
21st January 2012, 06:25 PM
...convert a "Blueprint" 2D ship to 3D?


Yeah, I got time. Everyday I hit up S.Up.

P.S. Have a team like FEISAR (max handling, etc) I got a little thing going on...

P.S.S. Found out there's a FX-150 website! With no info!

Xpand
21st January 2012, 06:34 PM
Oh man, please don't use sketchup. That's the worst program for making game models, really. Sketchup creates a lot of "trash" polys that only waste CPU memory... Try blender or something like that...

Killercrusher232
21st January 2012, 06:40 PM
Sketch up is good for proof of concept, also i'm going be learning how to use 3ds max sometime this year on my college course.

Xpand
21st January 2012, 06:41 PM
Well, that's why I said "for making game models"... It's just that you'll be waisting your own time by making a model twice...

Killercrusher232
21st January 2012, 06:46 PM
I guess so... a game that (I think) uses sketchup models is called 'Need for Madness'. it's a java racing game where you either have to finish first or destroy all opponents, a very fun game indeed.

Here's a pic:
http://www.allgamesfree.com/gameshots/online/screenshots/893-1.jpg

Xpand
21st January 2012, 06:51 PM
LOL, no man. that game is way older than sketchup. The lines are generated through a cel-shader... I used to play that when I was a little boy...

Killercrusher232
21st January 2012, 06:55 PM
You've just made yourself look really old! i'm 17 in feb!

Xpand
21st January 2012, 07:01 PM
Well, I'm going to be 19 in the 6th of February... I played that when I was around 8-9, so it wasn't exactly last year... :g

Killercrusher232
21st January 2012, 07:04 PM
I probably played it at around 10-11 so not that much difference between us. (it's still WAY better than many games on the internet)

Dayviewer
22nd January 2012, 02:04 PM
Started texturing the ship now, can't decide between blue/black or red/bleck collor scheme, when finnished i'll render it in both so you guys can choose :g

Xpand
22nd January 2012, 03:51 PM
Hey, I have some fictional FX-200 ship profile views that I made. Maybe we can use some of them?
Proton X:
http://threedmaniak.deviantart.com/art/FX-200-Proton-X-201064558?q=gallery%3Athreedmaniak%2F25962488&qo=112
Goteki:
http://threedmaniak.deviantart.com/art/FX-200-Goteki-201064269?q=gallery%3Athreedmaniak%2F25962488&qo=113
Piranha:
http://threedmaniak.deviantart.com/art/FX-200-Piranha-201064074?q=gallery%3Athreedmaniak%2F25962488&qo=114
Qirex:
http://threedmaniak.deviantart.com/art/FX-200-Qirex-201063887?q=gallery%3Athreedmaniak%2F25962488&qo=115
Assegai:
http://threedmaniak.deviantart.com/art/FX-200-Assegai-201063524?q=gallery%3Athreedmaniak%2F25962488&qo=116
Feisar:
http://threedmaniak.deviantart.com/art/FX-200-Feisar-201063284?q=gallery%3Athreedmaniak%2F25962488&qo=117
Harimau:
http://threedmaniak.deviantart.com/art/FX-200-Harimau-201063054?q=gallery%3Athreedmaniak%2F25962488&qo=118
Icaras:
http://threedmaniak.deviantart.com/art/FX-200-Icaras-201062670?q=gallery%3Athreedmaniak%2F25962488&qo=119
AG-Systems:
http://threedmaniak.deviantart.com/art/FX-200-AG-Systems-201062357?q=gallery%3Athreedmaniak%2F25962488&qo=120

Of course, we would change the names and make them seem like ships built from scraps of the older AG league models..

Dayviewer
22nd January 2012, 06:27 PM
Amazing looking designs right there man!
The Goteki looks like another design i had in mind to model next actually :P

Anyway the ship is done!!:
http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/7061/woship1.jpg
http://img851.imageshack.us/img851/2033/woship2.jpg
http://img851.imageshack.us/img851/5554/woship3.jpg
http://img850.imageshack.us/img850/1037/woship4.jpg

Decided to go with blue in the end myself :P
Mind that in the renders i used 2048x2048 textures instead of 1024x1024 but that's only because of the close up, will look fine in-game with 1024 :D
How do you guys want the geometry and diffuse map in the game? then i will export and upload it ;)

stin
22nd January 2012, 07:29 PM
Seriously, these designs are friggen awesome, I mean all of them!!!:clap

You guys certainly worked at this and you all should be proud of yourselves!:clap

stevie:)

zero3growlithe
22nd January 2012, 10:05 PM
Yeaaaaah!!! I've rebuilded my Player's Ship Controller Script and A.I's controlling script and I got 60-70% better perfomance so I can run my game on netbook with A.I turned on and with all effects including trees with no lag :hyper

Xpand
22nd January 2012, 10:12 PM
Awesome zero! :clap
And awesome ship dayviewer! That looks wicked cool! Reminds me of the WO Pure Goteki!

feisar rocket
22nd January 2012, 10:35 PM
Feisar looks gangster! lol, I have to make a Pulse skin like that!

Zero thanks for idea; like 2048, how there is 2048-50 leagues, how about, FX-150 - 250. Giving it an actual campaign mode.

Holy $h!+ Day, it looks like it could EAT a ship, not eliminate it! ;)

P.S. Triakis and Harimau can be used because they got introduced in FX-300 but then...

Xpand
22nd January 2012, 10:49 PM
Yeah, I said we could change the names and make it look like some amateur team just picked up the scraps of old ships to make a new one...

Rotational_aspect
22nd January 2012, 10:54 PM
Dayviewer> great work! Some crits though:

The colour scheme is a bit bland due to having just two colours used. Perhaps you should add some details in another colour (personally, I would think white would look good). By details I mean picking out any decals like numbers, sponsors or adding stripes etc.

The rivets are too obvious and draw too much attention to themselves- try to tone them back. If you want to go for subtle panel work reference aircraft photos.

Zero: nice one! Rewriting is always the best way. Do you look back at your old code and go ''what the hell was I doing?'' I certainly do....

And as another update: I've started to think of a way to use linear velocity to calculate collision damage- so if you are travelling at high speed and hit something........crunch!!!! Also, I have a variable speed system working now, so the AI knows when to slow down and when to accelerate.

feisar rocket
23rd January 2012, 03:08 AM
Yeah, I said we could change the names and make it look like some amateur team just picked up the scraps of old ships to make a new one...

Yeah, I meant the names... but copyright issues.

F.E.I.S.A.R
23rd January 2012, 03:13 AM
I was thinking...
FX-150 for amateur teams,FX-200 for those that proceeded from the FX-150 and teams we know.

feisar rocket
23rd January 2012, 03:21 AM
Yeah feisar, that's right..start to write some background story ideas. Though without naming any of the teams yet... :g

(sorry 4 double post, multi-quoting eats typing space) I just took it in! Alright! First, A max speed team, a.k.a, Pirhana fan ship/s.

P.S. Yeah F.E.I. (SGX time line)

150-99 (amature ships made.)
200-49 (some amature teams join offical groups)
250-299 (Teams finalized, FX-300 league is not amature, qualification starts)
300, quick Vinta k gameplay and creds

MyNameIsBom
23rd January 2012, 04:36 AM
Does anyone know where jese7095(or similar) went?

last time i saw jese(?) was quite a while ago, i think jese stopped going on this forum a while back...


Oh man, please don't use sketchup. That's the worst program for making game models, really. Sketchup creates a lot of "trash" polys that only waste CPU memory... Try blender or something like that...

Ya definitely, as everyone saw what happened to my zone ship, it had lots of "trash polys" and it made lots of unnessicery lines on the model.

@Feisar_rocket, um no nothing new yet, i am still stuck with 3DS MAX :brickwall why does it have to be so difficult?
and i am designing new ships on paper, again it kept getting close to the pre-existing designs. i got to really stop doing that..... but i cant :cold :frown:

Im not that helpful at this stage apart from designing ships and thats pretty much....

Well its great now that we have addition members on this project, but i recently had an idea... for the music of the game, maybe Unctuous could help us out? *fingers crossed*

zero3growlithe
23rd January 2012, 08:30 AM
@Aspect: I've only simplified it a little and modifed some functions according to this movie about improving perfomance (got rid of some math functions). As for collision ray I'm using two rays to detect six collisions xD (I mean one ray activates sparks according to place where it have been hit).

Dayviewer
23rd January 2012, 08:48 AM
Thanks guys glad you all like it! :D


Dayviewer> great work! Some crits though:

The colour scheme is a bit bland due to having just two colours used. Perhaps you should add some details in another colour (personally, I would think white would look good). By details I mean picking out any decals like numbers, sponsors or adding stripes etc.

The rivets are too obvious and draw too much attention to themselves- try to tone them back. If you want to go for subtle panel work reference aircraft photos.
Thanks for the crit man, yea some decals and sponsors would definatly make it alot better with the collour scheme, i'll have to design some logos and come up for some names for that first though, i'll tone the rivets back a bit as well when the logos go on there too ;)

Started on the second ship btw should be done the end of the week, started my first internship today full time so i don't have much time anymore :P

zero3growlithe
23rd January 2012, 03:42 PM
Solaristics have made some nice logos so I think you should take a look ;)
http://www.wipeoutzone.com/forum/showpost.php?p=202567&postcount=678
http://www.wipeoutzone.com/forum/showpost.php?p=202544&postcount=671
http://www.wipeoutzone.com/forum/showpost.php?p=202558&postcount=673
http://www.wipeoutzone.com/forum/showpost.php?p=202564&postcount=676
http://www.wipeoutzone.com/forum/showpost.php?p=202570&postcount=679
http://www.wipeoutzone.com/forum/showpost.php?p=202615&postcount=685
EDIT: New version of game just to show it's actual perfomance, no revelation: Download (https://rapidshare.com/files/2586627348/C-distra_Test.rar)
A.I ships are now zombie so if you touch it you'll lose speed... i can make them suck out your power too if you want xD

Rotational_aspect
23rd January 2012, 05:22 PM
Nice work, Zero! I like how all the features of WipeOut are in there now (respawn points etc). Seems very solid.

Mini update: I have started to make the scripts more user friendly by having properties for speed, handling etc available to change via sliders than through code....should make setting up ships or tweaking much easier.

EDIT: Someone I know on BlenderArtists made a 600 player race AI demo (simple AI but then 600 of them.....!)

EDIT 2: I have (I think) got all the controls down- when my AI goes round a corner too fast it will now brake until it can steer properly- again this is all user definable.

Xpand
23rd January 2012, 07:44 PM
Oh man... That was soo cool! :D Awesome! I love where this is going!
By the way zero, about the ships, like, the sparks placement and stuff, can you tell us if it's possible to make the placement be linked to an object coordinates? Like you are making a ship and you want it to throw sparks in a certain location. If we put a box with a certain property will the game place the sparks there? This is just so that you won't have to place the effects manually on every single ship, because that's a lot of work, I suppose...

zero3growlithe
23rd January 2012, 08:23 PM
That's not so many work but I'll work on it although it can be hard as:
1. There is still this damn scale thing... everytime I export something to Unity it has other scale (yeah, it can be in modelling software but we need to set default units for models [including tracks]) and with scale I'll give i.e. for ship changes overall scale for everything u'r doing with this object, which means that raycast offset for ship with (original scale * 5) will be different for object with (original scale * 2)...
2. Hmmmmm.... i thought there will be more reasons... nevermind xD This one is enough to consider.
If you want I can send you newest version of project of game so you can take a look and check what I mean

Rotational_aspect
23rd January 2012, 08:34 PM
Zero: in Blender there is the ability to re-scale a mesh to 1:1- does unity have such a feature?

Xpand
23rd January 2012, 09:01 PM
Well, all my ships are made in meters and in real scale: 1 3ds max units = 1 meters. If everyone made the ships with that scale then you wouldn't have to rescale anything...

Killercrusher232
24th January 2012, 08:48 AM
Someone I know on BlenderArtists made a 600 player race AI demo.

This is the GREATEST!
I mean as if racing 29 opponents in F-Zero X wasn't enough, or battling 39 drivers to first place in Daytona USA. In fact, where have all these vehicles gone? It seems to be only 16 now... but I want as many as you can fit on the track if not more!

F.E.I.S.A.R
24th January 2012, 03:11 PM
600 vehicles on grid? You'll need a track as large as the Nurburgring 24h config,and then some more!

Anyone considering porting this to Android?(just asking)

zero3growlithe
24th January 2012, 06:00 PM
Mini Update
I've added pitching to my game so if u'r pitching up it jumps a little higher but flyies slower too, but when pitching down it runs faster (it's only 5-8kph difference so no big deal) and it is harder to fall-off the track and it falls faster to the ground so almost no jumping :g Now it's time for barrel rolls ^^

Xpand
24th January 2012, 06:24 PM
Nice! You sure are working fast! 6 more days and I'll be back in action! Can't wait to see the barrel roll effect!
Also:
http://soundcloud.com/rbng-1/ngage
What do you think?

Also: Tons of free HQ skymaps:
http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?24038-Free-high-res-skymaps-(Massive-07-update!)

feisar rocket
25th January 2012, 02:33 AM
About the game it self, is there gonna be pits?

Br's?? Please don't, wouldn't it be hard to make it operate without bugs. How about... hyperthrust (chill Xpand ;)) It should be easier to program into the source code? (shield value = s , speed value = x (PyShell)

S= 100.0
linear velocity = (3 u/s ?)
linear velocity = x
print = x
>>> linear velocity
print linear velocity (Im checking if it's ok)
>>> (3 u/s ?)
(idk how u put button command or time)
input (button?), (3 sec?)*2 = X + time*0.5
S- (3 sec?)*2

Hopefully you understood... ish (thats as much as I know...))

It's okay if you don't want to... it's just a thought.

Rotational_aspect
25th January 2012, 01:51 PM
Barrel rolls should not be that hard, if in Blender (I imagine similar in Unity too):

1>Animate the ship doing a barrel roll

2>Use a ray to detect how far off the floor you are

3>If the ray is a certain distance and the player has enough energy (plus pressing some buttons) play said animation and increase thrust a little

4> Check for collisons- if there is a collison before the animation finishes then there would be no speed boost. But, if all 100 frames played then you would get the boost (and a reduction in health).

Hyperthrust would be easy too:

1> Get the players linear velocity

2> If it is a certain speed (and the player holds a button) deduct health but increase speed temporarily.

Pits are simple- this was one of the first things I made (Xpand indirectly taught me how to do this when I was learning Blender):

Cast a ray downwards- if it hits a certain material or object with a certain property increase the health value/ property of the ship. If health >= 100 then health = 100.

Speed pads are similar- if you detect a certain property or material add a percentage speed increase to the velocity of the player.

zero3growlithe
25th January 2012, 02:50 PM
Pits are simple- this was one of the first things I made (Xpand indirectly taught me how to do this when I was learning Blender):

Cast a ray downwards- if it hits a certain material or object with a certain property increase the health value/ property of the ship. If health >= 100 then health = 100.

Speed pads are similar- if you detect a certain property or material add a percentage speed increase to the velocity of the player.

Man, why ray? Simple trigger with tag and viola (I'm short on CPU on things like netbook)... as for hyperthrust I've just made it for fun so it boosts player and reduces health (it took ~5 min). As for Barrel Roll I just need to find an alternate way to keep two rotation variables. Why two? Becouse when there will be tracks that need ship to tilt left/right, i.e when track is changing from horizontal to vertical on world axis (from _ to | :g) I need to tilt my ship too so I'll make Barrel Rolls without using animation.
Oh, and my zombie ships are sucking my Energy fast like hell xD It's hard to get through them now... but I have cannon to kill them :P (btw. Now placement system is not freezing when they're destroyed)

Rotational_aspect
25th January 2012, 09:44 PM
The system I suggested was a generic one that could be made in any system.

Also, prepare for some serious vector maths with your barrel roll method!!

Good news with your position system too, I got around that problem by using some of the features of lists in Python (len, sort etc) that do not rely on fixed variables.

A question: how are you handling collisions? Are you using linear velocity or straight collision detection (e.g. a bump from a ship = - 5 health)?

zero3growlithe
25th January 2012, 10:25 PM
Couple of methods:
1. For ship-to-ship collisions I have special collider which detects only same type collider (with same layer) so you can ram other ships without flying over them (this one is without health change)
2. Ship's collider for detecting walls, bullets, or trigger for respawning (this one takes 2 points of life every frame when touching only EnemyAI ships)
2.1 On enemy ships it is only for detecting collisions with bullets and walls, for now it detects whether it's a cannon bullet or rocket (they don't have spark-activating rays for perfomance reasons)
3. Two rays on player's ship which handles sparks and by the way takes life according to actual rigidbody's speed (reacts only to walls)
Except for rays all of them are primitive box colliders with friction and constant rigidbody gravity turned off.

feisar rocket
26th January 2012, 01:04 AM
I see, thanks Aspect!
Zero, how fast is fast?

P.S. Aspect, you know any awesome tuts for Python? I just have the manual to go by so far...

Rotational_aspect
26th January 2012, 08:53 AM
Aside from forums like BlenderArtists, A Byte Of Python is a good introduction. Also check out (although outdated) Tutorials For Blender 3D which has code examples and (up to date) http://solarlune-gameup.blogspot.com/ has a series of beginner tutorials.

zero3growlithe
26th January 2012, 09:44 AM
@How fast is fast?@
feisar_rocket: What do you mean?

feisar rocket
26th January 2012, 09:53 AM
How the zombie ships are eating your shields and how you can't pass by.

zero3growlithe
26th January 2012, 03:13 PM
About 10 seconds to completely destroy your ship when colliding constantly. When I time it right I can pass them so I didn't make it impossible to win.

Rotational_aspect
26th January 2012, 05:27 PM
Just come across some code which has made my life a lot easier! It checks the magnitude of collisions, so if a ship hits anything I can see how 'hard' the collision was (ships, walls...anything!!). My weapons scripts automatically deplete the energy property of the target object hit so that is handled too. The only problem I have is that only the parent object registers hits, so children act as ghosts.

zero3growlithe> sounds cool! I take it the other ships lose energy too in the collision? Get a shield power up and slam into them!

zero3growlithe
26th January 2012, 05:47 PM
zero3growlithe> sounds cool! I take it the other ships lose energy too in the collision? Get a shield power up and slam into them!
They don't lose energy for now but it's just adding one line to my code so no problem, but this line gave me new idea. How about making something like powerful sideshift? Double tap sideshift button, hold it to charge and slam! If only I would be able to make online play it would be awesome to get rid of your opponent when head-to-head on wep off race. :g
(the only thing I dislike right now is that on keyboard controlling my ship now is pain in a**, so I'll start mapping controls to my PS3 controller. For those who don't own one I'll leave controll mapping enabled in script [input options when opening up the game])

Rotational_aspect
26th January 2012, 06:06 PM
Sounds similar to the F-Zero X spin attack- very handy!

feisar rocket
27th January 2012, 02:54 AM
Just came out the shower and had a "eureka!" moment.

How about level of simulation?
(I. damage only to shields, dumping weapon gives you shield energy. (basic WipEout)

II. damage done to shields first then armor, pits must be used to "cool" engines and regenerate shields (heat levels do not damage shields). (amateur WipEout)

III. full racing sim, batteries for engines and weapons must be recharged. Overheating, shield failures, weapon malfunction, battery overloads, is possible. Damage is done to shields and armor at the same time (shield - 60% damage to armor). Recharge lanes are activated (across pit lanes). Heat levels damage shields. Low shields = lower speeds. Possible engine failure from direct weapon impact to thruster. Once shields are "offline" they never restart (shields low -> shields critical -> shields fail -> shields offline). (FX-150 amateur league complete simulation)

I know it might be... impossible to get it like this, but I just wanted to share.

P.S. Thanks for Python tuts Aspect.

Rotational_aspect
27th January 2012, 08:00 AM
Some interesting ideas feisar rocket- I don't know if this would suit a 3 lap race, you may have to increase the race distances to make these features more meaningful, plus it would be a challenge to balance the gameplay.

Not impossible though.....

Killercrusher232
27th January 2012, 09:16 AM
This could be where endurance and speedway races could have a part

F.E.I.S.A.R
27th January 2012, 12:35 PM
I remember having a super speedway track made with twisted wires.
Plan View (http://www.wipeoutzone.com/forum/album.php?albumid=182&pictureid=2106)
Side View (http://www.wipeoutzone.com/forum/album.php?albumid=182&pictureid=2107)

feisar rocket
27th January 2012, 08:46 PM
Damn, forgot about it...

I see, Aspect. I even drew a HUD at school today

Xpand
27th January 2012, 08:46 PM
Just came out the shower and had a "eureka!" moment.

How about level of simulation?
(I. damage only to shields, dumping weapon gives you shield energy. (basic WipEout)

II. damage done to shields first then armor, pits must be used to "cool" engines and regenerate shields (heat levels do not damage shields). (amateur WipEout)

III. full racing sim, batteries for engines and weapons must be recharged. Overheating, shield failures, weapon malfunction, battery overloads, is possible. Damage is done to shields and armor at the same time (shield - 60% damage to armor). Recharge lanes are activated (across pit lanes). Heat levels damage shields. Low shields = lower speeds. Possible engine failure from direct weapon impact to thruster. Once shields are "offline" they never restart (shields low -> shields critical -> shields fail -> shields offline). (FX-150 amateur league complete simulation)

I know it might be... impossible to get it like this, but I just wanted to share.

P.S. Thanks for Python tuts Aspect.


I like the full-sim idea... The number of variables would be immense, but I'm starting to get a look at Java scripts for Unity, next wednesday I'll be working on this at 100%! :g

feisar rocket
28th January 2012, 02:10 AM
Learn that Java... maybe even drink some ;)

I gotta get bitten by Python, I got nothing... stuck. By Xpand learns Java, I'll learn Python.

MyNameIsBom
28th January 2012, 02:25 AM
anything i can do?

feisar rocket
28th January 2012, 01:38 PM
Well Bom, help me with a HUD, track, and ship discription. Is that good?

Xpand
28th January 2012, 01:58 PM
Learn that Java... maybe even drink some ;)

I gotta get bitten by Python, I got nothing... stuck. By Xpand learns Java, I'll learn Python.

Unity supports python? I never saw that anywhere...

feisar rocket
28th January 2012, 02:26 PM
I'm not sure if Unity has Python support. I was talking about Blender.

Hey, what's the ships dimensions have to be?

Xpand
28th January 2012, 02:41 PM
Well, I've been making mine in real-world realistic sizes: from 10 to 20 meters in length, 6 to 12 meters in width and 2-4 meters in height.... Those are the average measures of a fighter aircraft, which I reckon the AG-ships must be around the same size... I usually use a human analog: a line with 1.6-1.7 meters just to get a feeling of how big the ship will be in comparison to the pilot... I usually do that while still on the drawing board, in scale obviously, but in the 3D it's all real size...

feisar rocket
28th January 2012, 03:29 PM
Ah thanks Xpand!

Rotational_aspect
28th January 2012, 03:31 PM
I think Unity uses Boo (similar to Python), Java and C#. Zero will have the definitive answer as he is currently the UnityMaster™ 8)

zero3growlithe
28th January 2012, 05:18 PM
Ha ha, Unity master xD
And yeah, C#, JavaScript and Boo are used. JavaScript is good but it doesn't have the possibility to access external files so I have to add C# to my learning list :g No idea about Boo.
btw. I've divided Xpand's track on two objects and I can detect whether I'm hitting wall/track so now falling of the track is... IMPOSSIBLE, BWAHAHAHA! :cold:g
EDIT: New track: Up View (https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/f08AJ91HCKTyao6eDQAabZvKcBreqPaKGegrWrNQUJY?feat=d irectlink) | Perspective (https://picasaweb.google.com/106083964399065727105/DropBox?authkey=Gv1sRgCNLTttHbpPzySw#5702803554109 577250) (I'll make better texture...)
btw. If it reminds you something then know it wasn't on purpose :nod

feisar rocket
29th January 2012, 03:16 AM
Hmm... reminds me of a track in a gameboy game... Ah, Hotwheels World Race (?), first track. I gotta make with FZEP.

Got a few names... but copyrights won't allow it...

WipEout: Stream.
WipEout: Omega
WipEout: A-A.G.A.R (Amateur-Anti Gravity Association of Racing)
WipEout: Crimson
WipEout: Purity Project
WipEout: Corruption (opposite of Pure, see what im getting to?)

Killercrusher232
29th January 2012, 09:55 AM
WipEout: Spectrum

zero3growlithe
29th January 2012, 10:38 AM
Crimson Stream - Corruption
-------------------------------
S.P.E.C.R
Super Powered Energy Crafts Racing
-------------------------------
C.S.H.D
Celestially Streamed Hover Driving
-------------------------------
Catalyst Slider/Catalyst Acceleration/Catalyst Thruster
-------------------------------
Phantom Thunder/ Speed Master/Speed Phantom/Speed Ghost
-------------------------------
Speed Rush

Xpand
29th January 2012, 11:47 AM
One thing: DO NOT USE WIPEOUT ON THE NAME!!! :D

Killercrusher232
29th January 2012, 11:56 AM
AG Racing: Comeback

FX-150 Series: The Official Simulation

F.E.I.S.A.R
29th January 2012, 01:38 PM
Lightspeed:Foundations

Xpand
29th January 2012, 10:20 PM
1 moar pic!
2857
This is the turn before the beach tunnel in the last section of the track.
I named the game as Splitstream GX Prototype (because it's currently the prototype name of the game since we do not have a definitive name for it).
When I apply the textures to the buildings they will look like that without having to render anyhting, just within the Unity scene display.. And I found a 1024x1024 bitmap file with all kinds of tree textures.

feisar rocket
30th January 2012, 02:35 AM
Xpand, how much power would that take?

What are the ships names. Can I also have a picture of each?

Dayviewer
30th January 2012, 08:45 AM
1 moar pic!
2857
This is the turn before the beach tunnel in the last section of the track.
I named the game as Splitstream GX Prototype (because it's currently the prototype name of the game since we do not have a definitive name for it).
When I apply the textures to the buildings they will look like that without having to render anyhting, just within the Unity scene display.. And I found a 1024x1024 bitmap file with all kinds of tree textures.

Looking good man!

I will try to have that first ship texture and model scale updated this week so it can be put in the game, second ship model is finnished, now needs to be unwrapped and textured. It will all take a bit longer now though since i started working full time.
For the first ship i had the name Tesseract in mind btw what you guys think?

feisar rocket
30th January 2012, 11:51 AM
FX-150: The Official Simulation

So simple yet so complex (great... oxymorons ;))... in other words it's like Forza motorsport! Well Grand tourismo(?) the ultimate driving simulator. (Forza 2 is but...)