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Thread: Should glitches and uber-shortcuts be advertised or kept secret?

  1. #41
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    It isn't about proving anything, the two who have used the glitches are already up in the top 10 anyway, and a lot of the barrel roll locations and amazing short cuts you see were found by one of these people.

    It more like a situation where a group of highly talented pilots have taken an age to paint a wall, getting all the hard to get at bits, then they return a month later and a two of the people who helped paint it have been naughty and scrawled graffiti all over it, irritating the others.

    By their actions after the event I'm getting the impression that they are both regretting do it, which if they feel like that, sort of answers the question that is the topic of the thread.

  2. #42
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    Or maybe one of both who used to be very respected, decided to use all means necessary to reach top score without saying or showing how he was doing those awesome times (except a video of moa therma reverse). And maybe some speedlapers started to have some doubts about his records and (unfortunately) began to find some strange lines on several tracks and were convinced (even sure) that the guy used that lines to reach his top scores (even if he managed to hide his method by slowing down a little before passing the final line). Talon and amphiseum forward were too obvious for speedlapers that really know the track, so a second guy, one of those that showed almost all of the tricks for SL/TT decided to reveal what an impostor was the first guy, because several people (average pilots on the 1st guy psn's friendlist) started to reach top scores on sol2 speedlap.
    Some people (as me) already tried to talk about those problems (for example Darkdrium about the sebenco reverse's glitch or few posts in the "speedlap challenge" thread) but it didn't seems to interest lot of zoners unfortunately (less than the bsb case :roll: even if with bsb, w5lx or philippe1970 could never reached any top 10 on any track).
    The most pathetic thing about that, is the fact that the first guy is very skilled and didn't needed all that **** ! Result now : he's no more respected by some of the top speedlapers who knows about his "methods"
    Last edited by leungbok; 6th June 2010 at 10:07 AM.

  3. #43
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    I have just been having a PSN conversation with one of them, and he explained what the situation was and the turn of events that led up to what we have happening now.
    He has always been honest about it anyway, he never tried to hide it.
    Fair enough, I see that HE did it only to show up the person who was, and always has been the main culprit, ARFurtif.

    He has also told me about the other 5 tracks that have glitches.:-
    So now we have a total of 10.
    6 forward & 4 reverse, and no, I'm not going to reveal the rest of them, I want to view the private videos first to see what they entail and just how bad things have got.

  4. #44
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    OK, here goes. I like shortcuts for sure, ones like in XL where you cannot cut off half the track. I would not like these in HD if you could pass through walls. I though amphesium chen reverse tracks have very cool shortcuts. Those are the kind I like. I like the sol2 pirhapac (Ithink) video of him jumping off the track and landing further down using barrel roll boosts for his speed, awesome stuff, and difficult. I like the little ramps on the side walls that get you in the air to go further, anything like that. I don't even mind jumping using a turbo hitting a flat section up higher, and getting a little more distance, that is fine too. I do not like half the track jumps though if you could go off track and use massive glitches in the game physics.
    of note though, it is hard to say whether or not I think something is a cheat without seeing it.

    "@ 'jaw
    If the leaderboards are a complete mess, how else would people share their times? They'd be forced to use an unofficial site. ".

    I think people should use the unofficial site due to these issues. Times are better regulated here by far (they are not regulated at all on the official site). Also, this site has a better chance of surviving than the official site over time.

    "And just because something can be replicated in the game, doesn't mean it should be legit - if you can hit an invisible object that launches you into the air so you can fly away through a solid building and shave seconds off your time every attempt, that is clearly unintentional and shouldn't be used."

    Yes, but if it is in the game it needs to be allowed. I hate invisible walls as well, but they have been programmed into the game, to the unfortunate result of this anomolay. ON the Unofficial site this can be regulated. Joe schmo gets a record time on amphesium, but is 10 seconds behind on every other track. Someone like saturn or yeldar notice this anomoly, ask how he did it, or for him to show a video of a somewhat similar time. This has happened here before, but not often. ON this site, if something stupid like a half the track jump is discovered, it can be dissallowed on the boards, and regulated quite easily. On the OFFICIAL SITE noone regulates it.

    "And not all glitched times can be spotted from a mile away, even by a good player - what if some guy you've never heard of has a top 10 time? He could have a similar number of speed pads hit to other people, and be within a second of the top (for the purpose of example) legit time. But he glitched through a few sections and saved himself a heap of time, putting him in the top 10. Is that fair?"
    "And then some other guy you've never heard of misses a few speed pads but still has a respectable time that's highly ranked with a legitimate method. How would you call that?"


    If the times are on this site, he can be asked for proof through a video of a similar run


    "It ruins the leaderboards. The boards are a big part of the game - there's scores for every game mode except eliminator and zone battle. That's how you rate yourself. Sure it's fun to get the best time, but using a glitch is unfair on the vast majority of players who haven't found the obscure invisible barrier, reliable to hit or not, that allows you to wind up half the track ahead. Using methods set out by the game to get your time is the only fair way to go.

    The official times should be able to be made without breaking the game mechanics."

    Invisible barriers, agreed. However, with an official board that will not do anything about it, what are you going to do. The unnofficial board you can do something about it. you would just need to be willing to put your times there like people have done for the last 10 years. Yes, there would be less times, but they would in the end, be legit times, and the people who cared about the game to continue to play it, would keep putting in times.

    ONce again, I have never seen the invisible barrier thing. It sounds terrible by the sounds of it and would result in who gets the turbo more wins the race if you use it in multiplayer.

    Doesn't seem like there is a fix for this unless people use the unnofficial board.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by leungbok View Post
    ... Let's remember what happened for anulpha fwd zone mode !
    The reason I put that up was to exert pressure on the developers to fix
    the issue in time, since updates were still coming. Without the mentioned
    thread they would had never fixed it.

    As long as the problem can be fixed, put it up. Otherwise have fun with
    whatever you got.

  6. #46
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    I don't talk about you, mate, i talk about the guys that revealed the zone glitch on video, evil was done before you talked about it here (with some good results as the devs reacted on it) !
    Last edited by leungbok; 6th June 2010 at 04:30 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by leungbok View Post
    I don't talk about you, mate ...
    Same, more or less.

    I just wanted to point out why the thread was made. Some guys from the
    outside (xD) may thing it wasn't a good idea to put it up, emphasizing the
    glitch even further, which it did to some degree. But there came the patch.

    I would never make a glitch public if it would spoil a well sounded party
    nor would I use it on my own to gain a second or something. Personally,
    I love real results. If I don't get a real result, I'm wasting my time.

  8. #48
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    The "Problem" glitches that we should be concerned about becoming known to all, and thus opening the flood gates to a "Zone Zeus glitch" type proportions [that got to 1 in 10 recorded times in the top 1000 before SL fixed the glitch, I know, I counted them ] are the ones where there is a obvious couple of seconds discrepancy between the No1 glitched time, and a typical Yelder/Saturn/ Piraphaic/Leungbok top times.

    These are the ones that really stick out.
    All SL -Phantom- forward, Sol2, Sebenco, Amphesium & Talons Junction.

    The other 6 are known about, but have no times recorded on the leader boards because the persons doing them have, as Leungbok has said previously, slowed down before the finish.
    Which I would have to applaud their resolve as they obviously don't want to see the boards messed up any further either.

  9. #49
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    It looks like they cannot be done by accident very easily then, that is good

  10. #50
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    Keep them secret for the greater good.
    If it's something like going through walls and ceiling, where you also need some
    luck to pull it off, then it's just not fun, I mean you even see graphical glitches
    so it's really ugly and really not the way the game was meant to be played.

    Normal shortcuts are fine.

  11. #51
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    The fact is: wich ones are glitches and wich aren't?
    The one in moa rev can be executed both passing or not through the ceiling for example. Is that a glitch when you do and a shortcut when you don't?

  12. #52
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    yeldar2097 is offline WipEout HD Cup - Quarter Finalist Veteran Pilot
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    I see it as a glitch either way even though it is possible to do 8/10 times if you actually try to do it, simply because there is no alternative boost location to gain anywhere near as much time (about 3 seconds per lap o_O) as the glitch gives you.

    Keep them secret, keep them safe.

  13. #53
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    Looks like a set of irreconcilable problems, arguments and dilemmas that have been fully explored in this thread and thousands of old ones, and there`s no need for me to do the same. The consensus not to advertise the glitches seems sensible, though fairly academic. It would be great to have an "unbreakable" game, but that is probably just a dream and perhaps not even needed. Real competion can and will still happen between like minded, trusted friends and pilots who value fair competition more than anything else - same as it always has, so it`s not a terrible problem. Official scoreboards tend to suck, but wipeoutzone wipers always find a way to race fairly.

  14. #54
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    Hmmm, what do you think mates, of the speedlap records in venom class on amphiseum and talon fwd ?
    Myself i'm suspicious
    That's a reason for not releasing glitche's videos IMO, no ?

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    Just because I managed to get to No 20 doesn't mean I cheated . Yeah, it's a bit sad, 8 pads and nearly 1.5 seconds ahead :-

  16. #56
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    that records re glitched, but i don't believe the players did it on purpose. i really think it has something to do with online ZB-mode.

    if a record is made with a fury-ship, there's always the possibility of the "ZB-glitched-thing" (look sebenco fwd SL venom, "dirtykecks" time with triakis fury 3 SP), but a record made with a hd-ship couldn't be developed from the "ZB-glitched-thing". it could be a "real" glitched time.
    Last edited by JFthebestJan; 9th June 2010 at 02:36 PM.

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    theres 1 on tjr too, i have 2 glitched times on sl myself, flash and rapier. I thought was ok at time but regreted next day.

  18. #58
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    thats forgivable mate you were open and honest about your methods you even made a vid of it

    i havnt posted on this yet so heres my 2 cents ive seen the glitch vid and i dont think these glitches should be shared with the "public" they ARE game breakers for sure not shortcuts. most if not all of us agree we need to keep the leaderboards as free as possible from glitched times it just looks ugly. studio liverpool wont be fixing these problems so i think its up to us as a community to keep these things secret, its in our best interests

  19. #59
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    Rezatron is offline Banned for aggressive behaviour toward members, moderators and admin. Rapier Pilot
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainbeat View Post
    theres 1 on tjr too, i have 2 glitched times on sl myself, flash and rapier. I thought was ok at time but regreted next day.
    I still have that video (not sure if you kept it). I won't upload it anywhere publicly but if someone is curious I can send a link via PM.

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    Recors are supposed to be proof that you are the best pilot,not the best cheater. I'd rather not have a glitched record as I have ethics.

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