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Thread: 2.10 advert discussion, NOT a lawsuit thread.

  1. #21
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    Every wasted second is removed from your life, and life is short.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seraphim1982 View Post
    I don't get why everyone hates the adverts so much. I mean at best it only takes a few extra seconds to load the race...
    we're a bloody hard bunch to please, but i agree - a few seconds, no biggie, time enough to drag on a scooby and sip ribena, by the time you've exhaled, your thrusters would have warmed up!

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    Have a look...

    The Average American watches an incredible 4.35hrs. oh T.V. a day!
    An hour show is really a 44 minute show without commercials,
    so that's 16 minutes of commercials an hour times 4.35 equals 69.6,
    69.6 minutes a day times 365 days per year equals 25,404 minutes yearly, divide by 60 for hours that's 423, then divide by 24 for days and ya got 17.64 days a year. Of Non. Stop. Ads.

    Now multiply by 20 years and that's almost a full year of, yup commercials.

    Shall we get started in internet-based ads, or radio, or newspapers, billboards, and now our video games...

    Just a couple of seconds to spare? I want them back.

  4. #24
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    Television commercials, I mostly don't watch. Commercial tv has very little of interest to me, so I watch what does, the occasional movie on DVD, for instance, but mostly I watch PBS and college stations that also broadcast some PBS content. For commercial tv, my computer is always on; during commercials, I'm doing something else for the five minutes the commercials run. But commercial breaks that last less than a minute would be pure frustration, not enough time to really concentrate on some pleasant 'task'.

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    Hmm, I'm in Norway and I do get audio in the ads. Wonder why the swedish and other norwegian poster don't get audio on theirs?

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    The adverts don't waste my time as much as they damage my dignity. I'm not a cheap person and I don't lack so much maturity to be interested in Fat Princess this much.

    It's all Fat Princess all the time now. No more PixelJunk Monsters ad, which was also cheap and annoying, but now there is even less variation. By sticking mostly to Speed Lap and Zone mode, I narrowed the number of times I had to watch the Fat Princess ad to about 6 times an hour yesterday.

    The real victim is Wipeout. Can this truly be lost on them? I am a customer who's interested in Wipeout, which compared to Fat Princess is a luxurious work of art in good taste. If I am still playing Wipeout, after the 100th Fat Princess ad, do they really want to show me another Fat Princess ad?

    There's a way to put advertising in Wipeout with dignity and respect. They should at least take my money to remove the ads. Instead they've made the game a whore.

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    Indeed the repetitive nature of the adverts is starting to wear very thin. Last night I think I had one GT ad and one Motorstorm ad. After that it was Rocky all night, without fail. I really want WipEout as a franchise to continues and therefore revenue is important. But this way of doing things will only put people off and WipEout will lose out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by okam View Post
    Hmm, I'm in Norway and I do get audio in the ads. Wonder why the swedish and other norwegian poster don't get audio on theirs?
    Well, I live way out in the middle of nowhere (Indre Sogn, for those familiar with norwegian geography), so maybe Sony doen't think it's worth piping the sound all the way here?

  9. #29
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    The introduction of unwanted adverts into a product we have already paid for without our consent is disgusting and unacceptable.
    Mods closing threads and remaining neutral on this sore subject is also poor too from what I have seen imo.

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    I did not remain neutral, I've negatively criticised the adverts. The only threads I truly closed were a lawsuit thread, and a redundant troll thread, that would have just repeated the same things we already had a thread for. You guys have no right to attempt to start a lawsuit against Sony and base it here in a forum owned by a private individual who might have to suffer for your actions by being held legally responsible for them. Did anyone of you even bother to ask him if it was okay?

    I also closed the old 2.10 thread to give advert discussion its own thread because it had swamped all other discussion of 2.10 effects, and I also started a new thread for just those effects. This was done to give full scope to discussion of all the issues rather than only adverts. There are now three threads for discussing the results of 2.10. Four if you count the one IH8YOU started, which asks if you've stopped playing HD/Fury since 2.10, or at least reduced your play of the game. So please do not accuse me or the other mods with vague charges of stuff which is not true.

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    I echo Lance's sentiments. No-one is trying to silence opinions. I for one just want them to be expressed and dealt with in the right place and the right way.

    Coming from the point of view as an individual here, I don't like the way these adverts have been introduced. I appreciate that revenue is a necessity to keep the franchise alive, but if this is required then adverts should be in the game from the start and anyone who pays good money for it should be made well aware of their presence or likely presence. As I've stated before, I think their presence in the game will only harm the future of WipEout as people turn away from the game and become bitter and negative towards Studio Liverpool and Sony.

    So what am I doing about it?

    I have myself contacted Consumer Direct in the UK to inquire about the legality of this. I will post any feedback I get on the forum for everyone's information. If anyone wants to start a petition then I will happily sign it. I haven't currently had time to do this myself or to take any further actions. If people are to go down the route of legal action, as an individual who is in love with this franchise I will have to consider whether I feel it is of benefit or whether it will only harm the game's future.

  12. #32
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    You`re going about it the right way. It`s a consumer issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seraphim1982 View Post
    I don't get why everyone hates the adverts so much. I mean at best it only takes a few extra seconds to load the race you are playing and it increases revenue to SL so we can get more/cheaper DLC in the future.
    But I have to ask how would we know any of the ad money is going to the customer`s benefit? We don`t and we never will. There is no objective person or organisation that could say whether the ads were doing any more than just increasing profits. I would rather leave things as they are: you get what you pay for. It`s worked for a long time. Sony/SL clearly don`t want to leave it this way, so how could we trust them to tell us if the adverts benefitted us in any way? Particularly given the Ministry of Truth style Orwellian prounouncements that we often seem to get direct from Sony and their advertising allies in their Death Star HQ That was a joke, attempted anyway

    I think we need some form of action, but it needs to be proportionate. Legal action and talk of it is going way too far. This is just my hobby after all and if I`m going to fight a battle with my life there are better causes! I think some form of general circular letter that we could send to Sony and advertisers would be useful, to officially register our dismay at this move, using our real names. It needs to be simple and respectful. We would need to collate accurate information about whether ads continue to extend loading times and any other negative effects they have on gameplay. If loading times are still extended by ads then we have a very effective argument. It seems to be the case, but I don`t know for sure. We also have a good argument if it can be shown that 2.10 introduces new bugs on the back of adverts.


    Speaking of bugs, I once got a refund for a Studio Liverpool game by arguing to Sony, succesfully, that it was not fit for sale. It was an F1 game, and after their pit stops the AI cars would drive at pit lane or at best cruising speed for the rest of the race - up to another 40 or 50 laps. It all meant the race was over after the first pit stops. I could only conclude the game had been released without anyone actually carrying out a full distance race to test it. This kind of bug makes an F1 game pointless, obviously. There was another F1 game of theirs which advertised online play on the box, but when you opened it and loaded it you realised they had cancelled the feature but still sold the game with advertising for it on the box, which surely increased sales! I can`t remember if I got a refund for that or not. I think I kept it because the rest of the game was okay.

    The relevance of this tale is that I got my money back on the grounds that the game was mis-sold, or not fit for sale, in the first case. I think a similar argument could work with Wipeout HD. I think I could possibly argue that the game I have is not the game I was sold, though I`m not sure I can be bothered to have that argument and I do actually want to keep the game, after all. But I think this is another approach that could make Sony notice the issue. As a matter of fact, considering the adverts especially, I do think I have a case that I was mis-sold this game. I would still like an answer to all the terms and conditions questions about whether Sony have a right to do this, just so as a consumer I know what my rights are. I don`t think we are going fight let alone win any legal battles, but as consumers we can make our displeasure known very directly by contacting customer services, and with sensible arguments this could have success.
    Last edited by lunar; 8th November 2009 at 07:20 PM.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by DISRUPTOR View Post
    The introduction of unwanted adverts into a product we have already paid for without our consent is disgusting and unacceptable.
    Mods closing threads and remaining neutral on this sore subject is also poor too from what I have seen imo.
    What the mods are trying to do is control the bloodlust and the mob mentality - people are being very quick to light the torches, grab the pitch forks and shout their outrage.

    Wouldn't it be better to focus the discussion on what can be done about the situation, rather than re-hashing the same negativity over and over?

    And as for suggesting we're attempting to stay neutral on the subject - I've lost friends at Studio Liverpool because I've spoken out against the product on here, so get your facts straight before you say stuff like that.

    There are plenty of anonymous internet warriors hiding behind a username on here. Conversely, it's no secret who I am and what my background is and I've gone on record many times when I think there's something wrong with the series.

    I think the slapdash implemtation of the adverts has been a very bad decision and shows a complete disregard for the userbase - especially as an addition to a product that has already paid for.

    Is that clear enough for you Disruptor? 'Cos I don't think that reads particularly neutral.

    Myself, I hadn't even downloaded the 2.11 patch before I uninstalled the game on Friday night because I was upgrading my PS3 to a 500Gb hard drive and wanted to get the filesize down for the backup/restore. I've re-installed everything I deleted in the transition, but I have no intention of re-installing WipEout HD while it's showing me adverts.

    Same as I have no intention of letting mob mentality rule the posting traffic here - it's a discussion forum. Either discuss things in a mature and sensible fashion or threads will be locked.

  14. #34
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    All I'm saying is the adverts don't bother me one bit. It's not like there is a storyline to the game that it is interrupting and I'm not having extra money taken out of my wallet. Yes it's taking up a tiny bit of my time but to be honest if I was that pressed for it I wouldn't be sitting there playing a game.

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    It's not just about time; it's also about being subjected to loud, childish, obnoxious crap repeatedly; it does not respect the people who support the game and the company that makes it; it destroys the integrity of the game; it is an offence against the sensibilities of anyone who appreciates the art and science of creative effort, and that, for me, is the most damning thing of all.

    With the release of the PS3 Slim at an affordable price, Sony had pretty much convinced me to at least buy one for the gaming possibilities and potential as a Blu-Ray player, but this latest round of crapping on their customers, plus their seemingly neverending incompetence to run a good service, has convinced me not to support them in any way, and certainly not by spending my money on their products and services. I will not be joining any group effort to modify their behaviour in any way, but I take away with me what they once might have had. They will make no profit from me. If their eventual corporate ill-health or even complete cessation occurs, I will not regret their passing, because the Sony that once was the most innovative and finest of the mass hardware makers is already gone.

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    Well said Lance

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    I remember last time this happened someone posted a direct comparison on youtube of the game load times with and without adverts. Has anyone done the same this time around?

  18. #38
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    Loading times are obviously longer with Ads, no need to do any comparisons ^^

    I noticed something different - Ads did not show a single time when I was playing Zone (offline), maybe that's because Zone stages are being loaded a lot faster than Racing ones.
    So everyone, let's go in da Zone!

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    I do not own a PS3.
    The only thing making me want to own a PS3 was Wipeout HD.
    Ads make me not want to play Wipeout HD.
    Therefore, until ads are no longer a feature of Wipeout HD, there is no conceivable reason for me to buy a PS3.

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    Loading times are not the main issue, but a video would still be great to have as evidence, given longer loading times was reported as a reason the first wave of adverts were dropped. I think ranting on here will achieve nothing more. The only way we`ll get anything done is to approach Sony directly as individual consumers, with our complaints and our facts straight. We need to figure out the best way to do this.

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