Random HD Questions that don't need a thread of their own.

[trentdf]

After playing a reverse track zone, i realised the colours went backwards (which i find awesome), but i was wondering if it always starts at mach 1 colour scheme, or if it should start at supersonic colour scheme, or if the furthest you've got is the start colour scheme? If it's the last im gonna be pissed cause the one time i got to supersonic i forgot to take a picture, and apart from youtube i don't think im ever going to see that colour again

[KIGO1987]

Ive got a photo at that speed (not me unfortunatly) Looks sik. Be happy you got zone zues dude, thats a tough one to get.

[Connavar]

After playing a reverse track zone, i realised the colours went backwards (which i find awesome), but i was wondering if it always starts at mach 1 colour scheme, or if it should start at supersonic colour scheme, or if the furthest you've got is the start colour scheme? If it's the last im gonna be pissed cause the one time i got to supersonic i forgot to take a picture, and apart from youtube i don't think im ever going to see that colour again

it starts at supersonic but before you even start it goes to mach 1 colors.

[KIGO1987]

Yep. Pretty much thats how it goes.

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Anyway, how are you guys celebrating NYE around the world?

[djKyoto]

Anybody figure out when bombs go off?

Someones they go just as you drop them if someones behind you and you get caught up in the blast, while other times they don't and just randomly go off whenever, and you see you own bomb explode infront of you before you lap it.

[BARTgai]

I'm pretty sure the bombs are on a timer like they were in pulse. If they are not hit after about 30 seconds or so after being deployed, they will self-destruct.

[eLhabib]

Yes, and it's 20 seconds I think.

[Darkdrium777]

Closer to 20 seconds I think as well, because it's only at Phantom that you can lap your bombs, and laps always last around 20 seconds.

[OBH]

Ive noticed that while hosting, as i come out of a race the "extend timer" screen is still there for a few seconds.

However, at the bottom of the screen next to the "quit" icon, is the word "spectate" that quickly dissappears.

Was there originally going to be a spectator feature???

[trentdf]

regarding bombs, does anyone else have a problem with where it is placed online? i think it may be a lag thing, but honestly a bomb will blow up on me more often if i miss it, very rarely will it explode if i fly straight through it. There is also a delay sometimes-
here's the scenario- "uh oh, a bomb, better avoid it. oh good, i missed it.
... ... KABOOM! WTF?!?! I COMPLETELY MISSED THAT!! ARGHHHHHHHHHH!!!"

[leungbok]

Yes mate, i totally agree with you, the pulse/pure bombs had a less illogical behaviour

[rdmx]

These laggy bombs are very annoying and I'm sure many a race has been lost because of them. The mines work though but the chances are that these are strewn in a different place to the line that the person in front took on THEIR screen. The bomb that you hit I suspect is the 'actual location'.

[Laeke]

The bomb-lag thing is a bit annoying, you are taking a bet: will it blow? No way to tell...
As far as I can tell, I experience it and so is everyone.

A question though, still about online. Sometimes on open sections, like the Anulpha shortcut, a ship in front of me will take a large curve out of the track (as jumping to their death... or respawning) but get back on track. I suppose it is also a lag/extrapolation thing but it is a weird thing to look at (saw it for sure at Sol 2 as well)?

[Wellington86]

Hmm I have never taken the behaviour of bombs to be down to lag. If you look at a bomb you see there is a widening ring of light that repeatedly emanates outward from the bomb itself to the red ring around the bomb. I think this represents the size of the area in which you will detonate the bomb by entering.

So if you reach the bomb when this ring of light is not visible the bomb has no area of detonation which is why you can pass right through it, while if you reach the bomb when the ring of light is at its widest you will detonate it even from the other side of the track on Moa Therma (although I don't think it reaches across the widest parts of Anulpha Pass).

And if you listen to the sound that accompanies this effect you can hear that there is a pause between each 'emanation', which explains why it is possible to pass by a bomb unscathed about 50% of the time.

I can't prove any of this, but it's what I've always thought is happening. None of the other weapons lag at all, even when half the weapon pads aren't working and everyone is a ghost, so I don't think this has anything to do with lag.

[Darkdrium777]

It's not lag, it's a synchronization issue between all the PS3s playing in the same room, which is why bombs appear in different spots on everyone's screens. The problem is that this placement is irrelevant, the bomb will only detonate if you actually hit the spot where it was placed by the one who launched it. The ships also behave with prediction calculations made by your PS3, then these predictions are corrected with the next packet of information. I guess the problem comes with the fact that bombs are programmed to appear behind the ship that launches it, not in the actual spot where it is placed, when playing on the internet. Or something like that. It's weird that mines work a lot more times than bombs though, you would think they would use similar code, just a different timer and area of effect, physics effect and graphics effect.

[eLhabib]

Wellington, if what you described really was the way the bombs work, that would be a terribly stupid design choice! Because the only way to avoid being blasted would be slowing down to pass through the bomb at the right time! I wouldn't think that SL designed it that way...

Apart from that, I never noticed the effect you described myself, but maybe that's because I close my eyes real tight everytime I am about to hit a bomb

[crawdad62]

I close my eyes real tight everytime I am about to hit a bomb

I know you probably meant that jokingly but I actually did that last night. Well I was playing like but still having fun and I was so far behind that I wasn't really worrying about anything and I round a corner and there's a bomb and I just knew it would explode the second I got to it and as I passed I sort of "cringed" and closed my eyes. Of course it did explode

[Wellington86]

The point is not really to slow down for it but to just hope you get lucky. I too brace myself every time, lol. Darkdrium has himself given perhaps the best reason why this is not a synchronisation issue, namely that mines work 100% of the time. But I have a couple of others as well.

Bombs are almost always found to be dropped in logical places, e.g. on the fastest or most obvious racing line. If you change course and fly near the wall you will often still cause the bomb to blow up and slow you down. Why would someone have dropped a bomb right next to the wall? Also, it not only seems highly unlikely that the player has dropped the bomb in a very strange place, but that that strange place just happens to be exactly where you drive to avoid the 'fake' bomb. It happens too often for it to simply be a case of you coincidentally driving into the invisible, 'real' bomb.

The other point is that if the bomb functions how you propose it does, it has very little to differentiate it from the mines. It's just a big mine that stands on it's own. I think more thought went into it than that, and they decided to provide a chance of its not going off, which they balanced by making the bomb the weapon that most slows you down (except for being hit by all three rockets at once or all five mines at once), and by giving it varying detonation proximities.

I might be wrong on exactly how the bomb works, but I do think its behaviour is intentional.

[Darkdrium777]

I think you misread my post a little Wellington. I did say I think this is a synchronization problem. You introduce another question now that even makes it more likely, in my opinion. Let me draw out example situations.

I'm sure all players of WipEout HD are aware of the ghosting of crafts and the laggy behaviour, sometimes your opponents online fly through walls, don't get hit by your weapons, etc.

Well I think this is affecting the way bombs work, rendering the weapon almost ineffective when dropped in a wide open space.

You are on the track, and have a bomb pickup. You drop it right in the middle of the track (Say, in front of a speed pad, like I usually do ). Well there are many things that can and have happened to others as well as me I'm sure from that instant.

First: your opponent flies into the bomb on his screen, it explodes. No problem, that's how it works.

Second: your opponent does a sideshift or another evasive manoeuvre, and dodges the bomb on his screen. It doesn't explode. Again, that's how it's meant to be.

The two above cases probably mean that lag, ping, latency, synchronization, did not have an effect on the game at that particular time.

However, many more things can happen.

Third: Your opponent flies straight into the bomb on his screen. It does not explode. What can be the cause? Synchronization I think. I think that at that precise time, while he flew right in the middle of the track on his screen, he didn't on your screen, thus he didn't hit the bomb you launch. Which didn't make it explode.

Fourth: Your opponent dodges the bomb. It explodes. Again, a synchronization problem, but of the reverse effect. On his screen, he didn't fly through the bomb, but on your screen, because of the sync issue, he did, thus making your bomb explode. BANG!

Imagine the rest of the situations, like the bomb appearing in a different 'fake' spot on his screen because of sync problems, so he flies in the middle which appears clear, thus hitting the 'real' spot, making the bomb explode again. Etc. Etc.

[eLhabib]

Sounds very logical to me. Actually, it's very easy to clarify this. Does it happen in splitscreen multiplayer?